explain xkcd - User contributions [en]

2975: Classical Periodic Table

2024-08-21T18:42:52Z

172.71.151.96: order

{{comic
| number = 2975
| date = August 21, 2024
| title = Classical Periodic Table
| image = classical_periodic_table_2x.png
| imagesize = 740x530px
| noexpand = true
| titletext = Personally I think mercury is more of a 'wet earth' hybrid element.
}}

==Explanation==
{{incomplete|Created by A CREATURE MADE OUT OF WATER - Please change this comment when editing this page. Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}

An element is a basic atomic building block of the physical world. Ancient civilizations believed in a small number of broad elements. The most famous are the {{w|classical element|classical (Hellenistic) elements}} of earth, fire, air, water, and sometimes a fifth element such as "void", "ether", or "quintessence." The Chinese {{w|Wuxing (Chinese philosophy)|Wuxing}} was a bit different, dropping air and adding elements for wood and metal. Such elemental theories fell out of favor as alchemists and later scientists began to discover what we now recognize as the atomic model, and today 118 elements are recognized and organized into the {{w|Periodic Table of Elements}}.

Here, Randall has taken a modern periodic table and color-coded the modern elements with the four Hellenistic elements. Gaseous elements such as hydrogen are colored blue for "air." Bromine and mercury, the two elements that remain liquid at room temperature and pressure, are colored dark blue for "water." Radioactive elements along the bottom of the table whose isotopes have only extremely short half-lives are red for "fire," with the rest of the chart filled in brown for "earth." The "earth" region includes many elements which are radioactive but whose half-lives aren't extremely short; it isn't clear what the cut-off is.

The title text says that mercury should be classified as "wet earth". While it's a liquid, it has a very high surface tension so even large drops will stick together and may seem almost like a gel.

===Table Sections===
{| class=wikitable
! scope="col" | Section
! scope="col" | Real table
! scope="col" | Elements contained
! scope="col" | Explanation
|-
| Air || All noble gases and most reactive nonmetals || Hydrogen, Nitrogen, Oxygen, Fluorine, Neon, Helium, Chlorine, Argon, Krypton, Xenon, Radon || These elements are a gas at room temperature, so they are grouped into "Air".
|-
| Water || One metal and one nonmetal || Bromine, Mercury || These elements are liquid at room temperature, so they are grouped into “Water”.
|-
|}

This comic is similar to [[2913: Periodic Table Regions]], which also groups elements using unconventional methods.

==Transcript==
{{incomplete transcript|Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}
[Title text: Classical Periodic Table]

[A diagram in the shape of the periodic table of elements is split into labeled colored regions. Each region is labeled with a large letter over a word in smaller letters.]

[The regions and colors are as follows:
* A: Air: light blue: the first element and the upper-right of the main body, which includes noble gases, halogens and some non-metals.
* W: Water: dark blue: two separated cells in the main body.
* F: Fire: red-orange: the bottom stripe of both the main body and the separated section.
* E: Earth: brown: everything else, the majority of the diagram.
]

{{comic discussion}}

2968: University Age

2024-08-06T19:21:59Z

172.71.151.96: /* Explanation */ alternative hypothesis

{{comic
| number = 2968
| date = August 5, 2024
| title = University Age
| image = university_age_2x.png
| imagesize = 317x388px
| noexpand = true
| titletext = This only makes it more urgent that we adopt my roadmap for the next 10 years, which should put us solidly in the lead.
}}

==Explanation==
{{incomplete|Created by the HR HEAD OF THE OLDEST UNIVERSITY DESTRUCTION DEPARTMENT - Please change this comment when editing this page. Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}

[[Cueball]] has been the leader of a university for the last five years. In a speech, he declares that his goal during those five years has been to make his university overtake the age of the oldest university of his state, which was then two years older than his own (215 years vs 213 years old). He declares that he has funded an intensive program to make his university five years older, making it three years older than the other university was when he took the role. Due to the laws of time, this would have happened anyway, whatever he had done, or if he'd done nothing at all (barring his leadership being so catastrophic that the university ceased operating).

The final line of Cueball's speech, "Unfortunately, I have terrible news," presumably precedes the announcement that the rival university has also aged 5 years and is therefore just as far ahead as they were before.

To be fair to Cueball, his plan moving forward might be better than his plan over the previous five years, including discrediting the official starting date of the rival, arguing for an earlier starting date of his university, using Machiavellian tactics to lead to the closure of the rival, etc. Or could be just as impractical as his previous plan, ranging from just waiting (once again), to firing the rival through space at relativistic velocities.

In the title text, the "roadmap for the next 10 years" implies more of the same ineffective efforts, possibly strategies to undermine the rival, or an even more ambitious and incredibly unlikely plan to place the rival university in a spacecraft on a near-lightspeed journey, slowing the apparent age of the rival university with relativistic time dilation.

==Transcript==
:[Cueball is standing behind a lectern on a stage. He has raised a finger in the air while addressing an unseen audience.]
:Cueball: When I took the helm five years ago, our university was 213 years old – the second oldest in the state, just behind our 215 year old rival.
:Cueball: Under my leadership, we've funded an intensive program to increase our age to 218, overtaking our rival by 3.
:Cueball: Unfortunately, I have terrible news.

{{comic discussion}}

[[Category:Comics featuring Cueball]]
[[Category:Public speaking]]
[[Category:Time]]

2967: Matter

2024-08-03T03:28:51Z

172.71.151.96: /* Explanation */ the deleted sentences are completely wrong. Hawking radiation is completely antimatter-neutral. Inflationary fluctuations immediately after the big bang are theorized, but this is firmly in we-may-never-know territory.

{{comic
| number = 2967
| date = August 2, 2024
| title = Matter
| image = matter_2x.png
| imagesize = 234x341px
| noexpand = true
| titletext = He was the first person to land a 900, which is especially impressive because pulling off a half-integer spin requires obeying Fermi-Dirac statistics.
}}

==Explanation==
{{incomplete|Created by a GOOFY FRONTSIDE WIKI GRIND TO SECRET PHYSICS DEMO TAPE - Please change this comment when editing this page. Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}

In {{w|skateboarding}}, the term 'goofy' means to use the {{w|Footedness#Goofy_stance|opposite stance}} of the 'standard-footed' one where one pushes with right foot. This comic takes this as an apparent analogy of {{w|antimatter}} in elementary physics, which exhibits the opposite charge to normal matter will mutually destroy 'normal' matter (releasing energy relative to the original mass). This appears to be the kind of explanation that one gets when {{w|Tony Hawk}}, an ex-professional skateboarder of great renown[https://www.mobygames.com/game/3567/tony-hawks-pro-skater/], is teaching.

This metaphor also indirectly raises the problem of {{w|Baryon asymmetry}}, in which ordinary matter appears to be much more common than antimatter, unlike most{{citation needed}} distributions of handedness, chemical {{w|chirality}}, or the {{w|skewness}} of {{w|Multimodal_distribution|bimodal statistics}} describing asymmetries in nature (called {{w|homochirality}}, e.g., organ shape and centering, or plants favoring one branch over the other at a fork) and in artificial methods, while 'goofy-footed' skaters are about common as 'regular-footed'.

The use of Tony Hawk in the comic is could be a play on {{w|Stephen Hawking}}, a famous astrophysicist and professor at the University of Cambridge before his death in 2018. As Tony Hawk does not have a degree in physics{{citation needed}}, teaching popular but inaccurate versions is a likely pitfall of his professorship.

The title text talks of a {{w|900 (skateboarding)|skateboarding trick}} which involves two and a half rotations, or (eponymously) nine hundred degrees (2.5 × 360° = 900°). {{w|Spin (physics)|'Spin'}} is a quality of subatomic particles, named for the concept of {{w|angular momentum}} as it applies to elementary and quantum physics, and the understanding of {{w|Fermi–Dirac statistics}} requires that the particles involved exhibit spin numbers that all have a half-spin on top of any given whole number, much as with the 2½-rotations (albeit at a vastly different scale and only loosely considered even the same) of the trick that Tony Hawk could have performed.

==Transcript==
{{incomplete transcript|Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}
:[Tony Hawk (drawn with short hair) gesturing at a narrow whiteboard on which illegible things are marked, what may be a Feynman diagram with one of the particle/antiparticle pair going into a circle (possibly representing a black hole, and thus depicting the popularized(incorrect) analogy for {{w|Hawking radiation}}), and at the bottom, a 2x3 table of values.]
:Tony Hawk: In the standard model, regular matter will annihilate if it comes in contact with oppositely-charged ''goofy'' matter.

:[Caption below the panel:]
:Tony Hawk becomes a physics professor

{{comic discussion}}

[[Category:Comics featuring real people]]
[[Category:Physics]]
[[Category:Statistics]]

Talk:2948: Electric vs Gas

2024-06-21T18:19:01Z

172.71.151.96: another reply

Now I'm not a fan of gas engines, but that argument is in bad faith. Gas engines have one ''very big'' advantage over electrics: Energy density, and by extension, range. Batteries can't come close to the energy density of hydrocarbons, despite the latters' overall lower efficiency. --[[User:Coconut Galaxy|Coconut Galaxy]] ([[User talk:Coconut Galaxy|talk]]) 17:22, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

:I think that's one of the main arguments for hybrid systems. Using a gas engine to charge an electric motor, and then using the electric motor to actually power the appliance, enables significant efficiency gains. If anything, combining the technologies enables even greater ''usable'' energy density from hydrocarbons. Hybrid electric vehicles for example are extremely efficient. [[User:Eunakria|Eunakria]] ([[User talk:Eunakria|talk]]) 17:43, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
:Energy density, and the ability to move large amounts of stored energy from one place to another quickly and easily (aka pump gas, vs charge or swap a battery), from a thermal and maintenance perspective. (Which is not entirely unrelated to energy density.) [[Special:Contributions/172.70.39.54|172.70.39.54]] 18:08, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
::Swapping batteries (and slowly charging the batteries in the swap station) could offer comparable "charge" times to gasoline refuelling times, while also being better for battery lifespan, but would require industry coordination and standardisation re: battery packs and install location that, sadly, simply does not exist. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.42.212|172.70.42.212]] 19:54, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
::Plug-in hybrids have been superior since 1904, but the incremental capital cost is still an issue while oil is under $100/bbl. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.150.129|172.71.150.129]] 19:16, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
::A litre of gasoline provides 31.5MJ of energy, and in the US a pump transfers 38 litres (10 USgal) per minute, or 0.633 litres per second. That's an energy throughput of 31.5MJ/l x 0.633 l/s = 19.95MW. And US gasoline pumps are, by law, slow. In the civilised world, petrol pumps can deliver 30% more (50l/minute). Hi-flow diesel pumps used to fill trucks and buses are much faster - between 80 and 120 litres per minute. 120 litres per minute of diesel fuel is an energy transfer rate of about 76MW. By comparison, the fastest 3-phase AC chargers for the Tesla model 3 charge at 11kW; Pumping gas is about 2,000 times faster at getting energy into a car than this. The fastest single phase chargers are 7.4kW; While a standard wall socket charger can manage a paltry 2.3kW, (around a ten-thousandth of the energy transfer rate of a gas pump). The "super" DC charging stations achieve an "impressive" 250kW, making pumping gas at a regular gas station about eighty times faster than using one of these. [[Special:Contributions/172.68.64.207|172.68.64.207]] 07:00, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
: Except of course that this isn't quite as simple as this. A Honda Civic (one the most popular US petrol cars) will go about 400 miles on a full tank, about the same as a Dodge Ram. Also about the same as a Tesla Model S. There's a pretty good reason this isn't a coincidence - people don't want more much more range, and a bigger tank is more weight. A Chevy Silverado full tank will go about 500miles. If you really want range, you need to look at a hybrid car. As the comic points out, the torque on a standard otto cycle engine is poor, but that cycle is deliberately designed to give more torque. Hybrids use an Atkinson cycle which is far more energy efficient, but could not provide enough torque - so you use the electric to do that. A Prius has a range in excess of 630 miles, more than any popular petrol car. So if you want range, you still want an electric engine, just store the energy in hydrocarbons. For similar reasons, diesel trains use the diesel to run generators which then power the electric motors on the wheels, and have done for decades. {{unsigned ip|172.70.162.186|20:47, 19 June 2024}}
:: Which brings us back to energy density: The Honda Civic has a similar range to the Tesla – at 10% the weight for its fuel (vs. the Tesla's battery), and one-third the volume. The comparison gets even worse for long-haul cargo, but that might be beyond the topic of this conversation. --[[User:Coconut Galaxy|Coconut Galaxy]] ([[User talk:Coconut Galaxy|talk]]) 13:06, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
:How about we make an actual list, then?
:{| class="wikitable"
|+ Electric v. Gas Engines
|-
! +/- of Electric Cars !! +/- of Gas Cars
|-
| -Energy Density/Range || +Energy Density/Range
|-
| -Battery Life || -Fuel Efficiency
|-
| -Toxic Rare Earths || -Fossil Fuels
|-
| +Cleaner || -Motor Power
|-
| -Decrease Efficiency in Winter || +Lower Vehicle Weight
|} [[User:Fephisto|Fephisto]] ([[User talk:Fephisto|talk]]) 13:45, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

On the other other hand, in a lot of cases an electric motor is just a gas engine with extra steps due to the current state of the power grid. [[Special:Contributions/172.68.174.232|172.68.174.232]] 17:24, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

:Not here in Washington State it isn't. Most of our electricity comes from hydroelectric dams. [[User:RadiantRainwing|RadiantRainwing]] ([[User talk:RadiantRainwing|talk]]) 23:10, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
:: AFAIK, no new dams are being built, and I reckon that the probability is vanishingly small that any new dam that is mooted will survive the inevitable storms of protest and get built. The trend, rather, and the political pressure, salmon fans, is to remove dams (e.g. those on the Elwha River). The existing dams are aging, their impoundment volumes are dwindling due to sedimentation, and the water for those impoundments is increasingly bespoke and is, in at least some cases, declining in volume due to climate perturbations. The population, and its energy use, is increasing. As of 2022, [https://www.eia.gov/state/?sid=WA#tabs-1 I read], WA was a net exporter of electricity. I would not be taking that status for granted. A few years ago, a study was published, finding that, in states where the electricity grid was dependent on fossil-fuel-fired plants, electric cars had a <em>greater</em> carbon footprint than gasoline/petrol cars - and this was before the major gains in gasoline fuel efficiency contributed by advances in computer tech (2007 Honda Civic hybrid gets the same city mileage, ca. 35 mpg, as a 2021 Honda Civic petrol engine, in my hands). I do not know what current assessments say about this. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.150.129|172.71.150.129]] 04:23, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

:I'd say an electric motor powered by a hydrocarbon grid still usually makes better use of gas than a typical gas engine. Gas engines that don't always run at full throttle (as in, a gas engine in an appliance) have dramatically worse efficiency than electric motors that don't always run at full throttle. It depends ''very'' heavily on use case, though; always take measurements and run the numbers before coming to a specific conclusion. Science would be nothing without empirical data. [[User:Eunakria|Eunakria]] ([[User talk:Eunakria|talk]]) 17:50, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

Should this have [[:Category:Climate change]]? I can’t decide. [[User:Usb-rave|Usb-rave]] ([[User talk:Usb-rave|talk]]) 17:40, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
:Yeah, it's better with it for people looking though the category later on, they will want to see it. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.186.10|162.158.186.10]] 19:13, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

Honestly, with this argument the thing gas engines have going for them over EVs is the refueling time and availability. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.59.175|172.69.59.175]] 18:58, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
:That's fair. It would be nice if electric cars had been more focused-on ten years ago than the trend (trend? craze? idea? whatever.) starting now. I refuse to buy a Tesla, though. Elon is never getting my money. I'm waiting for an electric Volvo. [[User:Psychoticpotato|P?sych??otic?pot??at???o ]] ([[User talk:Psychoticpotato|talk]]) 13:27, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
:As in...you've ordered one, or you hadn't realised they exist?[[User:Yorkshire Pudding|Yorkshire Pudding]] ([[User talk:Yorkshire Pudding|talk]]) 21:00, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

It's really remarkable how uninformed and unintelligent this comic is, to the point where I now doubt the veracity of his entire What If? series. {{unsigned ip|172.70.114.62|19:13, 19 June 2024}}
:To be fair, there’s sort of an agenda here, while I don’t believe there’s one in ''What If?'' I can’t independently verify the accuracy of ''What If?'', of course, but there is that. [[User:Usb-rave|Usb-rave]] ([[User talk:Usb-rave|talk]]) 19:18, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
:I'd like to know more about the "uninformed and unintelligent" assessment. Given that not all of Randall's characters copy his ''exact thinking''. I don't think he'd espouse much of what he has Black Hat say/do. And clearly many of his Cueballs, even being often accepted as Author Avatars, can be clearly being dumber than Randall (who is 'writing them as dumb') is. What we have is parody. And maybe you just don't see the parody in the way intended (or understood by others). Perhaps you have a completely different mindset, or are just inclined to be anti-Randall> (Even in things he's actually right about...) I don't know where the mismatch may be here, but if you're seriously thinking that there remains not one useful take-away from anything Randall has ever said, just from the ''possibility'' that his cartoon characters don't completely mesh with what you perceive as a correct worldview, then this needs looking at from a different perspective than just reassessing the whole ''What If?'' corpus. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.74.24|162.158.74.24]] 23:15, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
: The tagline for the xkcd comic does include the word "sarcasm", which should warn against over-serious or over-literal interpretations. Not infrequently, I find, xkcd ventures into the realm of the sarcastic, the opinionated, even the polemic (cf. the Hilary Clinton campaign ads), and this one states a clear opinion in favor of electric cars ... with which one is free to debate (as here, exhaustively), or disagree. All of which brings the cartoonist to the attention of the world, and thereby supports him in his chosen line of work, which, in the current state of cartooning as a profession, is no small accomplishment. As for the opinion, consider the following question: "I have a four-mile commute to work. Which is the most eco-friendly option? The electric car? The hybrid? The gas/petrol car?" Answer: the foot car. Walking the four miles is the only minimum-carbon solution under all circumstances ... except perhaps ones that allow the questioner to keep deir job. [[Special:Contributions/108.162.245.4|108.162.245.4]] 05:39, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

Ohhh... OK. I had poor signal so this one took a while to load, and I only saw the "Gas vs. Electric" title. I thought it was going to be about kitchen stoves - ones that burn ''actual'' "gas", vs. electrical heating elements. [[User:Yorkshire Pudding|Yorkshire Pudding]] ([[User talk:Yorkshire Pudding|talk]]) 19:45, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

I actually experienced the "cons" of a less limited degree of power and not being noisy at all, today. Someone in an electric vehicle (could have been a Tesla) pulled out of a sideroad, accelerating at what seemed like a reckless rate (it was advantageous to do so, but a petrol-powered vehicle that might have taken a bit longer to switch up the gears would still have been up to speed soon enough to not get into contention with any other vehicles). And with barely more than a whine, and perhaps a bit of road-noise that might have included at one point a bit of grit-splattering. I was watching this, and knew they were pulling out of the junction (and knew for certain, moreover, that there was no traffic coming up or down the road, nor anybody crossing the road anywhere in my rather long sight). Had there been someone ''actually'' about to cross the road (within the next 50 yards or so), however, it would have been entirely possible that they would have been caught be surprise by this near-silent and suddenly fast-moving vehicle. If it was a Tesla, then maybe its inbuilt forward 'radar'/whatever would have helped bring the vehicle to a stop, or at least slow it down/stop if from speeding up enough, before any actual accident might have happened... but this is theoretical, as it just happened not to happen anything like this on this occasion... But it could have. And the paradigm for crossing the road that I learnt several decades ago of "Stop, Look, Listen, Think" has probably now started to lose out on the "Listen" bit, and possibly degraded even the "Look" and "Think" until we start to retrain ourselves to anticipate vehicles whipping around random corners that are far more silent-and-deadly then what we've all become used to. Ok, so this is not necessarily the total fault of the electric vehicles (or even the drivers, but they must have ''some'' hand in the matter), but in changing the dynamics and situational awarenesses of road traffic so much it ''might'' be considered a relatable problem. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.74.24|162.158.74.24]] 23:51, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
: I drove an electric motorcycle for a while, which put me quite exposed and aware of safety and my driving environment. The concerns about EVs being too quiet don't come across as grounded in reality. Modern ICE vehicles typically have minimal engine noise already. There are really two cases: out on the road, where half the people (exaggerating) have their earbuds in, and any engine noise is swamped by tire noise anyway. No difference between ICE and electric here. Then in a parking lot, where tire noise is not significant, and maybe pedestrians could get extra auditory cues about the vehicles around them from ICE engine noise. In that context, I personally would flip open my visor and make eye contact with pedestrians. It would be nice if drivers of full-sized cars and trucks, no matter their power source, would do more of that. Driving while inattentive is unambiguously bad. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.23.204|172.69.23.204]] 02:40, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
: Rolling noise becomes more than enough for safe audibility by about 30 km/h (below which speed collisions are relatively less dangerous anyways, though most urban streets really should have a speed limit of 20 km/h for numerous reasons including safety), and actually dominates engine noise by about 55 km/h. ICEs are loud enough to have like a dozen deleterious health effects even while idling, though the noise of a bicycle, if sufficiently constant, is enough to reach the WHO threshold. In short, electric cars only need to make additional noise below about 30 km/h for safety, and even then only 55dBA, quieter than typical speech, and even then only if there's already a lot of noise polution to drown them out. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.146.33|162.158.146.33]] 07:23, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
::Although really what they mostly need is drivers who look where they're going, and don't assume that people will just get out of their way when they hear them coming.[[Special:Contributions/172.69.195.124|172.69.195.124]] 08:44, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
::: Which is best accomplished using narrower streets, bollards, and other traffic easing mechanisms that make people want to slow down and pay attention rather than putting up a lower speed limit sign and just expecting people to obey it. That goes double in the US where most speed limits are assigned by looking at the speeds people are actually driving in good conditions and setting it where 10% of people woulld be speeding (and then rounded to the nearest 5 mph), meaning the sign is literally irrelevant to almost everyone. Oh, also, we desperately need to stop combining streets, which are destinations, with roads, which are thoroughfares, into "stroads" that fail at being both; that's an actual majority of your traffic easing taken care of basically in one step. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.146.234|162.158.146.234]] 10:01, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

I wonder if the current explanation is missing the forest for the trees. My impression was that White Hat was parroting a ChatGPT-style response -- noncommittal and logically incoherent. (In fact, I missed the logical non sequitur the first time I read the strip. The style just screamed to me ChatGPT, though.) [[Special:Contributions/172.71.154.9|172.71.154.9]] 00:55, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
: I agree about missing the forest for the trees. Everyone's so focused on the opinions being expressed, they're totally missing what to me is the whole point of the comic: poking fun at similar kinds of pro vs. con comparisons but where some/any/all of the points are actually on the wrong side of the argument. So while on the surface the comparison appears balanced, it's actually incredibly biased. Sure all of that stuff is interesting for those wanting to know more about the actual pros and cons of the particular subject being discussed; but that's just the vehicle Randall happened to choose for delivery. Now I'm not sure if ChatGPT / AI plays into this, aside from it probably being more likely to produce this kind of unintentionally biased comparison; but I'd assume given the absence of cues implying as much that this comic is not related to AI. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.146.236|172.71.146.236]] 19:06, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
:: Forgive me, but I believe "where some/any/all of the points are actually on the wrong side of the argument" has been well covered. Stating a couple of IC-Cons/EV-Pros ''as if'' EV-Cons/IC-Pros (and possible reasons why they could reinterpret things that way). Or is there yet another objection, and you aren't also meaning that? [[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.64|172.70.91.64]] 20:08, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
::: It's touched on, barely; but most of the explanation (and commentary) is so focused on rehashing the arguments for/against the different types of vehicles that it's easy to miss. I'm sure those topics are already well covered elsewhere, do we really need to go into so much detail here? [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.96|172.71.151.96]] 18:19, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

This comic was posted yesterday and I'm already seeing people typing essays. I'm scared. (also electric rules gas drools nyehh) [[User:Psychoticpotato|P?sych??otic?pot??at???o ]] ([[User talk:Psychoticpotato|talk]]) 13:22, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
: Not too shabby a result from a stick-figure drawing posted on the Internet. Jealous? As for 'electric', nice to see your unqualified support for [https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2023/02/01/1152893248/red-cobalt-congo-drc-mining-siddharth-kara slave labor in the Congo] and elsewhere. Get a horse! [[Special:Contributions/172.68.23.73|172.68.23.73]] 13:40, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
:: Isn't a horse also a form of slave labour?[[Special:Contributions/172.71.242.223|172.71.242.223]] 13:52, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
::: PETA would likely agree with you, to the point of sabotage if widespread re-introduction of bestial labor looked like being a thing. So, if we shut down the electricity grid to quell the AI revolt (if resource limitations don't compel that shutdown sooner), and we are denied fossil fuels for reasons of climate destruction and, again, resource limitation, this time-honored path to civilization will likewise be refused us. At least initially ... [[Special:Contributions/172.71.147.133|172.71.147.133]] 01:47, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
::There are several things wrong with your assessment, [[Special:Contributions/172.68.23.73|172.68.23.73]] (although I do wish my comics got this much attention). The first is your assumption that I know the exact methods used to gather battery materials (I don't). The second is saying I support slave labor, which I '''''ABSOLUTELY DO NOT.''''' The third is your assumption that I have the space, money, resources, skills, and time to purchase and take care of a horse. I don't! Slave labor is appalling, the DRC is a nightmare, and horses have more needs than I could fit into a week. Back to electric cars, though: they're generally better for the environment, they're quieter, they're more powerful, and their engine systems are really cool and fun to look at and see in action. Gas(oline) engines are loud, smelly, pollution-heavy, and subject to violent explosions in a crash. Electric is better in general. It's a good idea to manufacture them, but I agree with you on the need for changing battery material-harvesting methods. [[User:Psychoticpotato|P?sych??otic?pot??at???o ]] ([[User talk:Psychoticpotato|talk]]) 17:26, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
::: I argue that knowing the state of the electric-economy supply chain, the resources needed and [http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2023/ph240/cadicamo1/ the limitations on their availability] as well as how they are procured, is necessary for any informed stance. I argue further, if you and I are wantonly snapping up electric gadgets, and, as is typical, are scouring the Internet for the cheapest possible prices for those gadgets, then you and I are screaming our support for human slavery in the only term$ that matter. The cry "Get a horse!" was a catcall aimed by horse owners at owners of early 20th-century automobiles, which were orders of magnitude dirtier and smellier than today's machines, were essentially non-functional, and took insignificantly less labor to maintain than the horse. You are absolutely correct about the maintenance needs of a horse, and indeed most people in the "horse and buggy days" couldn't afford either the cost or the time to own one. They were symbols of the 1% - who had slaves, be they chattel or hireling, to maintain their stables. From where I sit, the issues associated with actually realizing the fantasy of an electric economy are far more existential than changing battery-material harvesting methods, and I no longer accept that We the People will, or even can, face up to, never mind resolve, the issues. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.147.133|172.71.147.133]] 01:47, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
:::: Sounds like [https://www.visualcapitalist.com/every-single-cognitive-bias/ selective outrage] to me. Do you have a clue what kind of disaster the fossil fuel industry has wreaked (and continues to wreak) upon the world? [[Special:Contributions/162.158.166.214|162.158.166.214]] 06:22, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

and now i know why xkcd doesn't have a comments section. [[user talk:lettherebedarklight|youtu.be/miLcaqq2Zpk]] 07:35, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

That the argument is fallacious is the point. It is hardly a first for white hat. It shouldn't be seen as a serious "pros and cons" argument, it would be obvious to anyone reasonable, including Randall, that there are real cons to EVs (how important they are is up to debate). But as evidenced by previous comics, white hat is not particularly reasonable. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.130.143|172.71.130.143]] 11:27, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
:Rather than "not particular reasonable" (more the realms of Black Hat), I'd have said "not particularly rational"/similar is White Hat's schtick. But I do agree with you in principle, and don't understand half the 'objections' above, if serious. [[Special:Contributions/141.101.99.172|141.101.99.172]] 13:29, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

2929: Good and Bad Ideas

2024-05-08T21:21:16Z

172.71.151.96: /* Table of the entries */ say what think - quote, spammers - gain control computer

{{comic
| number = 2929
| date = May 6, 2024
| title = Good and Bad Ideas
| image = good_and_bad_ideas_2x.png
| imagesize = 595x522px
| noexpand = true
| titletext = While it seemed like a fun prank at the time, I realize my prank fire extinguishers full of leaded gasoline were a mistake.
}}

==Explanation==
{{incomplete|Created by a BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD- Please change this comment when editing this page. Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}

This is a scatter plot comparing how good an idea sounds to how good the idea is. For example, leaded gasoline sounded like a good idea due to its anti-knocking effects, but is a bad idea due to lead toxicity. Fake prank fire extinguishers both sound bad and ''are'' bad, as they can make a dangerous situation worse. Putting mold on infections sounds like a bad idea, but some molds, like ones containing penicillin, have helpful antibiotic effects.

The title text combines leaded gasoline and a fake prank fire extinguisher into something worse than either. The fire extinguisher is fake and releases flammable material onto the fire, and there is additional lead toxicity.

===Table of the entries===
{| class="wikitable"
|-
! Idea !! What it means !! How good it sounds !! How good it actually is !! Explanation
|-
|{{w|Leaded gasoline}}||Adding {{w|Tetraethyllead|tetraethyl lead}} as an antiknocking agent to allow for increased performance||++||---||Leaded gasoline was introduced in the early 1920s to allow higher pressures and temperatures in an engine without causing {{w|Engine_knocking|detonation (knocking)}}, allowing for increased fuel efficiency and engine performance; it also works to prevent engine valve wear. In essence, it artificially raises the {{w|octane rating}} of the fuel, reducing the need for fuel refinement, thus reducing waste and/or expense. Lead, however, is both toxic and bioaccumulative, meaning that lead released into the air over decades built up to harmful levels in people (as well as other animals) and almost certainly contributed to a host of health issues. Some scientists even suppose that {{w|Lead–crime hypothesis|crime levels are influenced by lead exposure}}. (It should be noted that this only "[sounded] like a good idea" due to deliberate campaigns to obscure the known dangers).
|-
|{{w|Bloodletting}}||Releasing "bad blood" from the veins||---||---||You need (most of) your blood. Losing [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK542273/ more than 15%] of a person's total blood volume results in adverse effects. Bloodletting was performed as a medical procedure for at least 2000 years until the 19th century. The idea was to withdraw blood to balance the body's "humors". Despite this long history, the notion that bleeding someone is bad now seems like basic common sense, and it's now well-understood that blood-letting (outside of {{what if|98|certain rare and specific cases}}) does no good, causes significant harm and quite certainly causes many deaths.
|-
|{{w|Asbestos}}||Mineral which does not burn, tolerates extremely high temperatures and forms small fibers. These qualities make it excellent for insulation and fire protection||+++||---||Asbestos was used extensively in ships and buildings throughout most of the 20th century. Unfortunately, the microscopic fibers that make up asbestos greatly increase the risk of {{w|Asbestosis|lung disease}} and cancer when inhaled, causing its use to be banned in most countries.
|-
|Extension cords with prongs on both ends||allows easy connection between 2 female connectors||0 (neutral)||---||Prongs on both ends would make it easier to plug the extension cord in on either side. But once plugged into an outlet, the other end becomes a serious shock hazard, as seen in [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L08LjkN1k70 this Backyard Scientist video]. Shot circuits (both ends connected to outlets supplying power) would be much more likely, resulting in more sparks, fires, and damage to wiring.
|-
|Stair kayaking||Riding down a flight of stairs in a {{w|kayak}}||--||---|| Stair kayaking is a stunt where a person positions a kayak at the top of a flight of stairs and then, using their paddle to push off, [https://youtu.be/46BjHAxgddU?t=154 rides the kayak down the stairs]. This poses significant easily foreseeable risks of injury or death, as well as being very bad for the kayak, which is designed to ride on {{w|Kayak|water}}, not stairs.{{Citation needed}}
|-
|Fake prank fire extinguishers||Intentionally placing empty or otherwise non-functional {{w|fire extinguisher|fire extinguishers}} as a {{w|practical joke}}.||---||---|| The idea of placing fake fire extinguishers as a prank, presumably so that a person who thinks they are grabbing a real fire extinguisher will instead find a decoy, sounds very dangerous and potentially life-threatening for many people, and it would be highly dangerous. In the United States, (and presumably most countries), this would also be a felony in most, if not all, jurisdictions. An example of a similar situation, although not intended as a prank, can be found [https://twitter.com/ThatSamWinkler/status/1657154071051239424 here].
The title text expands this idea by having the prank fire extinguishers filled with (leaded) gasoline. This is literally adding fuel to the fire.
|-
|Always saying what you think||...regardless of the feelings of others or other considerations||++||--||Openness and honesty are seen as positive character traits in people. However, taking it to the extreme of ''always'' telling people what you think, can lead to awkward, unpleasant or dangerous situations. It may harm your relationship with the other person if they don't like what you think, or they may reply without concern for ''your'' feelings or other considerations. Keeping negative thoughts to yourself or telling "white lies" can be considered a better alternative in some situations. Saying what you think to somebody in power (a boss, soldier, dictator, drunk) can negatively impact your earning potential, health, or freedom. [https://quoteinvestigator.com/2010/05/17/remain-silent/ "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt."]
|-
|Replying to spammers||Clicking on the "Reply" button from {{w|spam email}}s and writing (and sending) a reply (or worse, clicking on the links in these emails)||--||--||At best, you confirm your email address and identify yourself as someone likely to respond to such messages and so encourage the spammers to deluge you with more messages. At worst, the spammer may extract sensitive information about you, make you a victim of a scam, or gain control of your computer.
|-
|{{w|Solar car}}s||Having {{w|Solar panel|solar panels}} on the car's surface (mostly hood and roof) for power generation||+++||-||Powering electric vehicles with solar panels seems like an excellent idea: it would provide free power with no increased land use, and theoretically could allow a vehicle to operate indefinitely without being fueled or charged. However, such vehicles couldn't operate without batteries (due to power requirements, weather conditions, shade from roadside features and nighttime driving), so they'd have increased complexity compared to plug-in or hybrid cars. Adding solar panels would add cost, weight, manufacturing complexity and maintenance requirements. Solar panels on moving cars are less efficient than in stationary installations and subject to damage from both collisions and road debris; even without these problems, the size of automobiles relative to their power requirements would sharply limit the car's range (unless it was a normal electric vehicle with supplemental solar panels). Solar cars do exist (the {{w|World Solar Challenge}} is a competition for such cars), but as a practical form of transportation, the negatives likely outweigh the positives.
|-
|Heelies||{{w|Heelys}} are shoes with an inline skate wheel embedded in the sole, at the heel. ||+||-||Heelys allow the wearer (usually children) to shift between normal walking and rolling like being on skates. This sounds like fun but [https://abcnews.go.com/Health/Exercise/story?id=3242181&page=1 has been suggested] to be a potentially significant injury risk.
|-
|Prequels||A work of fiction (mostly movie) telling the "story before the story" of another work of fiction.||+++||-||More of a good story sounds great on the surface, and audiences who are invested in a set of characters and/or a setting often love the idea of finding out what led up to certain events. But there are several pitfalls. Any spin-off of a popular property risks becoming a low-quality cash grab. Prequels, specifically, are constrained by the fact that they have to lead to the story that's already been released, which can lead to contrived storytelling. There's less room for suspense since the future of the storyline has already been established. There's a tendency to invent or fill in detailed backstories, which can undermine character arcs, and/or destroy the mystery and nuance of certain characters. And, since they tend only to be made where the original is already well-received, regression to the mean tends to mean they are more likely than not to fail to live up to expectations. Prequels can be good, of course, but there are a lot of ways they can go wrong.
|-
|Transitions® lenses||A brand name for {{w|Photochromic_lens|photochromic lenses}} in glasses, which get darker (like sunglasses) in bright light.||+||-||Photochromic lenses are clear lenses that darken when exposed to UV light, then turn clear again when the exposure is removed. The advantage is that wearers of glasses don't need to buy separate (prescription) sunglasses. However, the process is relatively slow (about a minute) so not so useful when there is a quick succession of shade and bright light, perhaps in a forest or when driving. If used in a car, the windscreen filters out UV light to some degree, which prevents the glasses from darkening as required. Finally, the process is temperature dependent, so in hot weather the glasses don't become as dark, and in cold weather they might stay dark for too long.

Additionally, the following should be considered. UV-conscious people protect their face against UV light, so the skin doesn't form wrinkles and ages slower. Sunscreen is difficult to apply around eyes without getting the substance on eyeballs (cosmetic substances should not get there). One of the reasons behind wearing sunglasses may be to protect skin around eyes from forming so called {{w|wrinkle|crow's feet}}. Under UV-filtering sunglasses, UV-activated transitions contact lenses will not darken defeating their purpose. At the same time transitions contacts are typically at least twice as expensive as the regular ones.
|-
|Cutting pizza in squares||Cutting (a presumably round) pizza in squares||-||-||Most people cut pizza into wedges and hold it by the crust. Cutting it into squares could allow for more pieces to be shared, if the resulting wedges would be too thin to be practical. However, pieces near the center will have no crust to hold it by, getting cheese and sauce all over your fingers. Cuts around the edge will probably leave smaller leftover scraps which are mostly crust. While hardly a disaster like the other items in its quadrant, square pizza pieces are just not very useful and rather inefficient. Cutting a rectangular pizza into squares might not suffer from the problems above, but, unless the pizza itself is square and cut only into four squares, some people will end up with a higher crust-to-topping ratio than others. Cutting a round pizza into squares is popular in Chicago and is sometimes called tavern-style or party-cut and some<sup><nowiki>[</nowiki>''{{w|Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Words_to_watch#Unsupported_attributions|who?}}''<nowiki>]</nowiki></sup> consider it the real Chicago style pizza rather than deep dish pizza.{{Dubious}}
|-
|{{w|Project Orion (nuclear propulsion)|Project Orion}}||Study by the U.S. government looking into nuclear pulse propulsion for spacecraft.||---||-||Using repeated nuclear explosions to generate motion sounds bad for both the spacecraft and everything else, especially with a ground launch, but there are ways to address a lot of the concerns, so it isn't as bad as it sounds. Project Orion's theorized specific impulse and thrust would also be far higher than anything chemical rockets can accomplish. The efficiency of Project Orion is extremely low, however, and the {{w|ablation}} issues are extremely difficult to overcome.

See also [[2423: Project Orion]].
|-
|Soup||{{w|Soup}}||0 (neutral)||0 (neutral)||Soup is probably one of the oldest foods created by prehistoric cooks. Many people enjoy it, though some consider many soups somewhat lacking as a meal on their own, or boring.
|-
|Combo washer dryers||A device that combines washing machine and laundry dryer into one device||+++||+||Better at space efficiency, but worse at each task than separate devices, and unable to do both tasks in parallel (useful when you have more than one batch of laundry).
|-
|Cutting sandwiches diagonally||Cutting sandwiches diagonally||+||+||[https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/math/a32690399/triangles-rectangles-best-way-cut-sandwich-math/ Generally] [https://www.npr.org/2009/11/28/120914097/rectangles-vs-triangles-the-great-sandwich-debate regarded] as the superior way to slice a sandwich, providing more aesthetically pleasing display of the contents, better support in the hand and fewer all-crust bites. Required in the assembly of a club sandwich,{{actual citation needed}} where the diagonal components are stacked again.
|-
|{{w|Diverging diamond interchange}}s||Road junction where the two (sets of) lanes cross over to switch sides (so if you normally drive on the right, now you drive on the left), then switch back to normal after the junction||-||+||Highway engineers believe the shape improves safety and traffic flow through the interchange because switching to the other side facilitates merging to and from the other road in the junction. However, the shape appears to be insanity to an unfamiliar driver.
|-
|Toasting sandwiches||Making a sandwich first and then cooking it, as in a dedicated {{w|Pie_iron|sandwich toaster}}, a {{w|toaster oven|toaster oven}}, frying pan or under a grill.||++||++||The grilled cheese sandwich is a familiar form to most people, and many other sandwiches are improved by toasting as a final step. Others, such as the {{w|western sandwich|Western}} or {{w|club sandwich|club}} are prepared using toast. The {{w|peanut butter, banana and bacon sandwich|Elvis}} is a specific case of a sandwich that normally wouldn't be toasted, but is improved by it - peanut butter, bacon, banana, and jelly, with the assembly lightly fried.
|-
|{{w|Crumple zone}}s||Designated areas of a car that crumple in case of a crash. ||--||++||Most people's intuition would be that stronger cars are safer, and intending parts of a vehicle to collapse ''by design'' might seem crazy. But engineered crumple zones are designed to absorb the kinetic energy in a vehicle collision, and do so in such a way as to protect the integrity of the passenger cabin. The result is that the occupants experience less intense deceleration and ideally without the damage significantly compressing the shell around them. This significantly reduces the danger of injury or death from crashes.
|-
|{{w|Sliced bread}}||Bread, sliced by the baker before packaging for sale||+++||++||It's far more convenient for making sandwiches or toast, but unfortunately pre-sliced bread will go stale faster and some applications may be better off thicker or thinner than the slices provided. Sliced bread is often used as a comparator for how good something is, using the phrase 'the best thing since sliced bread'.
|-
|Pizza||{{w|Pizza}}||++||++||Pizza is a widely popular dish throughout much of the world, uncontroversial {{w|Anchovies_as_food|except}} {{w|Pineapple|certain}} [https://www.taste.com.au/recipes/nutty-choc-pizza-fresh-berries/2c0220a4-8463-45ff-b2ba-ac7e5012a006 toppings].
|-
|Eating citrus fruit while at sea||Having a supply of {{w|citrus fruit}} on long sea journeys, especially during the {{w|Age of Sail}} ||0 (neutral)||+++||For a long time, {{w|Scurvy|scurvy}} was a danger to sailors, who generally subsisted on a monotonous diet of shelf-stable foods with low vitamin content while on long voyages. Most citrus fruits are rich in vitamin C, which prevents scurvy. Eating orange or lemons doesn't seem like a significant activity one way or the other, but it's an easy way to prevent a disease that causes serious ill-health and possibly a painful death.
|-
|Putting mold on infections||Seemingly a reference to the ancient practice of pressing moldy bread against infected wounds||---||++||While this sounds like a good way to get a fungal infection, with the correct mold this is a primitive way to obtain an antibiotic. Certain fungi naturally produce antibiotic substances, and this is where humans discovered {{w|penicillin}}.
|-
|Wheels on luggage||Some luggage bags have small wheels inset on their frame and a carrying handle.||+++||+++||A relatively simple fitting for rigid or semi-rigid luggage that substantially eases its transport over long distances on flat surfaces such as travel terminals.
|-
|{{w|Heat pump}}s||A technology that moves heat energy from a cold area to a warm area, most familiar as the technology that keeps a refrigerator cold. It can be used to heat a home interior in winter or cool it in summer.||++||+++||Unlike traditional furnaces, heat pumps do not generate heat (beyond a small overhead). Instead, they move existing thermal energy from a coolable environment across to a warmable one. This allows a space to be heated with significantly less energy use than a furnace or resistance heater that just generates heat 'from scratch'. Because these units are operated by electricity, they can provide heating with renewable energy (potentially using {{w|thermal energy storage}} for load-shifting), reduce or eliminate the need for natural gas connections, and prevent several risks that come with traditional furnaces (such a carbon monoxide leaks and fires). In addition, heat pumps can operate in the reverse direction as air conditioners, so a single unit can be designed to both heat and cool a building. It sounds like a good idea and works out better than expected in real life.
According to [https://www.technologyreview.com/2023/02/14/1068582/everything-you-need-to-know-about-heat-pumps/#:~:text=Heat%20pumps%20today%20can%20reach,today%20reach%20around%2095%25%20efficiency. MIT Technology review]:
<blockquote>Heat pumps today can reach 300% to 400% efficiency or even higher, meaning they’re putting out three to four times as much energy in the form of heat as they’re using in electricity. For a space heater, the theoretical maximum would be 100% efficiency, and the best models today reach around 95% efficiency.</blockquote>

See also [[2790: Heat Pump]].
|-
|{{w|Laser eye surgery}}||Surgical techniques using lasers for precision cutting in the eyeball.||-||+++||In the popular imagination, lasers are often thought of as something used for destroying their target. Firing them into people's eyes, then, does not sound like a great idea. However. this technology has substantially improved the eyesight of millions of people worldwide by allowing the treatment of eye problems otherwise only corrected by lenses or entirely untreatable. Randall has previously commented on laser eye surgery, amongst other ideas both good and bad, in [[1681: Laser Products]].
|-
|{{w|Fecal transplant}}s||Transfer of the gut microbiome of a healthy person to the sterilized gut of an ill person.||---||+++||The gut microbiome is a collection of bacteria that lives in our guts. It can influence our health. It is responsible for the last stages of digesting our food. It can also produce neurotransmitters that are carried by blood to our brain influencing our behavior. A healthy microbiome can be destroyed by bad eating habits, unhealthy lifestyles, acquired infections or the use of antibiotics. The important part is the composition of different species of bacteria that compromise the biome. Sometimes it may be necessary to completely sterilize the gut and then take a sample of a healthy biome from another person. A sample is enough as the bacteria will multiply. As long as the patient eats correctly, the microbiome after transplant should develop correctly.

It sounds bad because we tend to think of our feces as something gross, to be discarded, and other people's bacteria as infectious. It is called fecal transplant as our feces contain about 50% of gut bacteria, but nowadays the sample usually takes the form of a coated pill that is applied rectally.
|-
|}

==Transcript==
:[Two axes with double arrows cross each other in the middle. At the end of each arrow, there are labels. Scattered over the chart are 28 entries. Below these entries are given for each of the four quadrants, plus three that are on the Y-axis. For each quadrant the entries are listed in reading order, top to bottom left to right.]

:[X axis from left to right:]
:Sounds like a good idea
:Sounds like a bad idea

:[Y axis from top to bottom:]
:Actually a bad idea
:Actually a good idea

:[Top left quadrant (sounds like a good idea, actually a bad idea):]
:Leaded gasoline
:Asbestos
:Always saying what you think
:Solar cars
:Heelies
:Prequels
:Transitions® lenses

:[Top middle (actually a bad idea):]
:Extension cords with prongs on both ends

:[Top right quadrant (sounds like a bad idea, actually a bad idea):]
:Bloodletting
:Fake prank fire extinguishers
:Stair kayaking
:Replying to spammers
:Cutting pizza in squares
:Project Orion

:[Center (neutral):]
:Soup

:[Bottom left quadrant (sounds like a good idea, actually a good idea):]
:Combo washer dryers
:Cutting sandwiches diagonally
:Toasting sandwiches
:Sliced bread
:Pizza
:Wheels on luggage
:Heat pumps

:[Bottom middle (actually a good idea):]
:Eating citrus fruit while at sea

:[Bottom right quadrant (sounds like a bad idea, actually a good idea):]
:Diverging diamond interchanges
:Crumple zones
:Putting mold on infections
:Laser eye surgery
:Fecal transplants

==Trivia==
*A much leaner version of this comic appeared in the first [[What If? (book) | "What If?" book]], chapter "Weird (and Worrying) Questions from the What If? Inbox, #9".

{{comic discussion}}

[[Category:Charts]]
[[Category:Scatter plots]]
[[Category:Rankings]]
[[Category:Food]]

Talk:2929: Good and Bad Ideas

2024-05-08T20:10:59Z

172.71.151.96: Added discussion comment that bread is actually bad.

Lots of bread/food in the "good" quadrant; I think Randall is hungry. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.154.73|162.158.154.73]] 05:33, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
:FYI bread -- all bread -- is actually toxic and harmful to us.... Currently, there are three ways this occurs:
- USDA organic standards permit the application of Round-Up (glyphosphate, an herbicide/weedkiller)
to 'organic' wheat -- after it has been harvested. Reason is so they can harvest while it is still green (rather than mature dried-out golden)... Then apply the weedkiller in order to kill & desiccate it... Which lets them faster turn-over, shorter crop cycles, more production per time.
. Unsurprisingly, things designed to kill life are bad for us. (causes cancer and nerve damage)

- secondly the manner of harvesting wheat and turning it into bread changed since the industrial revolution... I do not recall the specific detail but it is more inflammatory now.

- Third, alas heating a number of various foods above the boiling point of water leads to more drastic biochemical changes in the molecules...
... This includes nuts/seeds, meat, & grains.
see california p65 re: bread.
.
causes cancer.
.
trivia:
anthropologists & medical doctors several hundred years ago visiting the americas found that nomadic forager/gatherer tribes were usually in better health, lived longer, & had fewer incidents of tumors (post-mortem autopsies, even in those days) compared to nations or tribes with a history (even pre-euro-contact) of sedentary/agrarian/farming communities.
guess this is due to less diversity in diet, incl greens, less exercise, but also the rise in cultivated grains or cereals like maize.
still better than the hellhole we are in today...
[[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.96|172.71.151.96]] 20:10, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

Soup always seems like a very good idea to me. I guess I like soup. --[[Special:Contributions/172.69.79.182|172.69.79.182]] 07:15, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

I remember something like this in what if. [[Special:Contributions/SectorCorruptor|SectorCorruptor]] 07:21, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
:The title immediately reminded me on the Animaniacs shorts "Good Idea / Bad Idea" [[User:Elektrizikekswerk|Elektrizikekswerk]] ([[User talk:Elektrizikekswerk|talk]]) 07:33, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Does anybody know why solar cars and transitions lenses are actually a bad idea? [[Special:Contributions/172.70.160.173|172.70.160.173]] 09:11, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
:Transitions lenses are misplaced. The only caveat is that if you like outdoor photography (landscapes, wildlife, etc.) you should get grey lenses rather than brown ones, because the brown ones make a blue sky seem overcast. [[User:Pjt33|Pjt33]] ([[User talk:Pjt33|talk]]) 09:22, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
::The precise opposite is true. Grey lenses make ''all'' things - blue sky included - look greyer, as is perhaps unsurprising. Brown tints involve a degree of orange, which means the overall impression is of a "warmer" colour pallette, rather than simply a duller one. There is a reason that "grey skies" and "overcast" mean ''exactly'' the same thing - an overcast sky ''is'' a grey tinted filter. [[User:Yorkshire Pudding|Yorkshire Pudding]] ([[User talk:Yorkshire Pudding|talk]]) 09:48, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
:::But perceived colour isn't the same as the actual colour hitting the retina: the brain corrects it. A blue sky filtered through a grey lens is still perceived as blue, but I find that a blue sky filtered through a brown lens appears grey. This is from personal experience: I switched from grey Transitions to brown ones because the frame that I liked was a brassy colour, and I regretted it when I next went out for bird photography. [[Special:Contributions/188.114.111.152|188.114.111.152]] 09:22, 8 May 2024 (UTC)
:I think the Transition lens issue is primarily that the bright light that can turn them dark need not be heading into the eye. With the Sun (say) off at an angle, it could be 'reacting' your lenses to dark needlesly, and reducing your ability to discern the things in front of you (which may be in shadow), working against the basic ability of the eye to adjust itself as per observed illumination.
:Conversely, a small bright light would not sufficiently darken the lenses but be still damaging to the spot(s) it falls upon in your retina (or do the "whole lens go dark" thing and ''still'' be too bright even as you can't see anything else beyond it). This might also be combined with the general secondary problem of potentially all regular sunglasses/goggles, that aren't industrial-grade or specific solar-specs, in that it might make it ''look'' safe to stare at bright things/skies through them but you cannot tell how much UV/etc is also being filtered out (some brands do have notable UV protection, but you really have to trust their claims/certifications – unless you have your own testing kit and knowledge of how much is good/bad anyway).
:I'd add that, but it needs a sharper explanation than I just gave. I'd like to make what's already there snappier, before that, plus correct the numerous typos and funny formatting (and lack of useful wikilinks), but will probably leave that to others with the time. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.242.204|172.71.242.204]] 10:08, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Just as a note while we're here: "fecal transplant" is one of the most spectacular branding failures in the history of medical science, in my opinion. I mean, don't put the word "fecal" in anything you want people to feel positively about. And "microbiome transplant" is sitting right there, ready to serve.[[Special:Contributions/108.162.242.37|108.162.242.37]] 10:44, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Double plug cords are VERY MUCH a bad idea. Used mostly to plug generators into an outlet to power a house, it tends to harm people working on the power lines who were not expecting them to be charged when the power was out. The statement about them being hard to use, is quite the understatement. OSHA, written in blood. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.115.103|172.70.115.103]]

How can soup be bland? There are bland soups, spicy soups, sweet soups, savory soups ... you can't call an entire very broad category of food "bland" like that. It makes no sense.[[User:Nitpicking|Nitpicking]] ([[User talk:Nitpicking|talk]]) 11:46, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
:I think they may have meant bland as in boring, not tasteless. I'll tweak it. [[User:Barmar|Barmar]] ([[User talk:Barmar|talk]]) 16:20, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Citation format needed. (heelies) {{unsigned ip|172.70.178.103|12:57, 7 May 2024}}
:''Summary: (I don't know how to format correctly.)'' - no, you don't...
:For a link to an external URL, writting <code>[the_url]</code> will give you a "linked number", but a better format is using <code>[the_url text to replace]</code> (with a space betwixt the URL and the text that will link to it. e.g. [https://google.com a link to google] from <code><nowiki>[https://google.com a link to google]</nowiki></code>.
:There are full on citation/reference methods, but mostly I wouldn't bother with <nowiki><cite> and <ref> tags</nowiki> at all.
:Internal links, with [[]]s, and template-based ones, with {{}}s (e.g. the nicely-linking shortcut to wikipedia pages), use a pipe (the "|") between the sections. But you should be able to work that out by looking at what is already in the edit-source.
:If in doubt, Preview your intended change and see if it looks right. I'll let you correct your contribution. Or whoever else wants to shake up the whole article, as it has multiple problems from spelling mistakes to inconsistent style to repeating information and it needs a lot of rationalising that I can't even think of doing right now. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.195.113|172.69.195.113]] 14:09, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
::I didn't realize we actually have no citation templates. Quite a few pages have the actual citation needed template but not many of them ever get those citations. I think a lot of citations get put in just as external links. I probably should've done that but I was like oh I know how to do this from my small amount of Wikipedia editing, I'll just use the cite web template... oh we don't have that. So rather than just do an ad-hoc link I created the citation in my Wikipedia sandbox then manually recreated the formatting. But now it feels weird and out of character for this wiki so maybe someone should just change it to a link. idk, maybe being inconstant is exactly what is in-character for this wiki. [[User:Brycemw|Brycemw]] ([[User talk:Brycemw|talk]]) 15:10, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
:::I changed it to a link. I've seen the occasional citations section in this wiki, iirc, but we general just do links :) [[User:Elektrizikekswerk|Elektrizikekswerk]] ([[User talk:Elektrizikekswerk|talk]]) 07:02, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

As a Columbus native, I am HIGHLY offended by this anti–rectangular pizza slice speech. Rectangular pizza is by far the BEST shape that a pizza can be. (I'm not really offended, but I really do think rectangular pizza is superior.) [[Special:Contributions/108.162.216.229|108.162.216.229]] 14:04, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
:Sicilian pizza should be square and cut into square slices, Neapolitan pizza should be round and cut into sectors. The extra thickness of Sicilian means you don't eat it by holding the crust and folding, so the shape of the slices is less critical. But this does mean that the middle slices have no crust around the edges. [[User:Barmar|Barmar]] ([[User talk:Barmar|talk]]) 16:25, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Leaded gasoline isn't to reduce *noise*. The noise is a symptom of detonation (aka knock), which is the real problem. Knock is caused by pressures and temperatures high enough and for long enough to detonate the fuel/air mixture (as opposed to the deflagration initiated by the spark plug at a set time), and can result in engine damage. Leaded gasoline (through complicated chemistry) increases the pressure/temperature required to get that detonation, and thus allows the engine to be designed to run at higher temperatures and compression ratios, which is where the efficiency improvements come from. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.39.41|172.70.39.41]] 14:38, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Maybe, cross-reference "Sliced bread" to [[1065:_Shoes]] and [[1885:_Ensemble_Model]] (with sliced bread in both comic and title-text).

I think that the phrase "best thing since a sliced bread" refers to sliced bread in general (as opposed to eating the bread directly or tearing pieces of it) and not specifically bread pre-sliced before buying.

Also, heat pumps, whole not DESIGNED to heat by itself, actually have a limit for how big difference in temperature they can operate in. Outside this limit, they work quite badly and only by heating by itself.

Finally, soup is GREAT idea. -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 18:49, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Yeah, why ''is'' soup in the middle? [[User:Psychoticpotato|Psychoticpotato]] ([[User talk:Psychoticpotato|talk]]) 20:45, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Did some grammar editing. Nothing too drastic, just fixing some too-lengthy phrases and misspelled words. [[User:Psychoticpotato|Psychoticpotato]] ([[User talk:Psychoticpotato|talk]]) 20:59, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Extension cords with prongs at both ends are actually a even worse than what's currently on this wiki. There's a list of other issues [https://www.consumerreports.org/home-garden/generators/why-suicide-extension-cords-are-so-dangerous-a1189731437/ here], which I'm not sure how well I can sum up within a reasonable amount of space. Stuff like feeding power back into the electrical grid putting electricians working on the grid at risk, or dealing with the exhaust from the household generators the cables usually come with. There's all sorts of reasons why major stores refused to manufacture or sell these, but for some reason they've become shockingly common. [[User:NickNackGus|NickNackGus]] ([[User talk:NickNackGus|talk]]) 02:09, 8 May 2024 (UTC)
:"...they've become shockingly common." Good pun. ''OR'' That would have been a good pun, had it been intended. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.160.166|172.70.160.166]] 10:50, 8 May 2024 (UTC)
::[[No Pun Intended]] (does that hotlink?) Edit: cool, it does. [[User:Psychoticpotato|Psychoticpotato]] ([[User talk:Psychoticpotato|talk]]) 12:37, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

Photochromic lenses are also bad for night vision: “...the optical transmission of the lenses was no more than 80% efficient and, taking into account all of the other known factors, was probably less at the time of the accident. This compares to 94.7% and 99.4% optical transmittance of ordinary uncoated and coated lenses, respectively.” – At least that was the [https://www.gov.uk/maib-reports/sinking-of-sailing-yacht-ouzo-after-encounter-with-ro-ro-passenger-ferry-pride-of-bilbao-off-isle-of-wight-england-with-loss-of-3-lives conclusion] of UK's Marine Accident Investigation Branch for a particular set of glasses worn by the bridge lookout.
[[Special:Contributions/162.158.95.9|162.158.95.9]] 12:52, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

You cannot get a fungal infection from mold. [[User:SDSpivey|SDSpivey]] ([[User talk:SDSpivey|talk]]) 13:59, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

Project Orion is also the production codename for an upcoming Cyberpunk 2077 sequel. For a moment there I was thinking "Randall really didn't like that game, huh?" [[Special:Contributions/172.70.54.21|172.70.54.21]] 16:11, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

2838: Dubious Islands

2023-10-07T17:24:09Z

172.71.151.96: /* Transcript */ punctuation

{{comic
| number = 2838
| date = October 6, 2023
| title = Dubious Islands
| image = dubious_islands_2x.png
| imagesize = 740x1040px
| noexpand = true
| titletext = Running for office in Minnesota on the single-issue platform 'dig a permanent channel through the Traverse Gap because it will make this map more satisfying.'
}}

==Explanation==
{{incomplete|Created by a DUBIOUSLY LARGE ISLAND - Please change this comment when editing this page. Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}

The definition of "island" is a piece of subcontinental land completely surrounded by bodies of water. In most cases we don't count rivers and canals as the surrounding bodies{{citation needed}}, although small pieces of land like Manhattan are exceptions. Inland islands surrounded by rivers are called [https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/holm "holm"].

Randall has ignored this, so he considers large parts of North America as "dubious" islands because they're separated from other parts of the continent by major rivers, canals, and large lakes.

The repetition between the title "Dubious Islands" and the in-image label "Dubious Islands of North America" emphasizes the "Dubious-ness" of this map. "Dubious" means "thought not to be completely true or not able to be trusted" (per Cambridge Dictionary).

Randall's map's "Dubious Islands" are indeed not to be trusted -- they leave out many rivers and canals which would break them into many additional "islands". For example, southern Nova Scotia, southern New Jersey, and the nearly 60-mile-long "Grand Strand" of South Carolina are also islands by the sense used here in recognizing the Cape Cod Canal as creating an island.

These and many other omissions would be errors -- except that Randall clearly labelled his islands "Dubious" (not to be trusted) from the start, and he is presumably well-aware of this map's inaccuracy.

The {{w|Parting of the Waters}} explains the connection between the Yellowstone and Snake Rivers shown.

{{w|Isa Lake}} drains into both the Snake River (via the Lewis River) and the Madison River (via the Firehole River), explaining the connection there.

It is unclear why {{w|Divide Creek}} which connects Hudson's Bay to the Columbia River is not shown on this map.

The title text suggests that a new island could be created by digging a canal through the {{w|Traverse Gap}}, and this is Randall's platform when running for office in Minnesota. This is unnecessary and would create little benefit to residents,{{Citation needed}} but constituents who like interesting maps might vote for him.

These islands are possibly Randall's humorous interpretation of what continued climate change-induced sea level rise might cause. But this seems unlikely since some of the connections shown are over 7000' in elevation, a water level that would leave almost all of North America (and many of these "islands") completely submerged.

==Transcript==
{{incomplete transcript|Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}
:[Title:] Dubious Islands of North America
:[Subtitle:] And the waterways that separate them

:[A map of mainland North America, down to the Panama isthmus. It is internally separated by various waterways, given labels or otherwise.]

:[Separating land approximating Nunavut (with some Northern Territories) from neighbouring Canada:] Mackenzie Athabasca Churchill

:[Comprising the much of the remainder of Canada, much of the northern United States (including Alaska), additionally separated by:] Columbia Snake Madison Missouri Chicago [Unlabelled, some of the Great Lakes and the channel past Quebec]
::[An incursive gap near the central point, from the north:] Nelson Red
::[An internal label, with arrow:] Traverse Gap
::[An incursive gap near the central point, from the south:] Mississippi
::[A separate fragment of land south of the Madison, in the western half of the land-mass, bordered to its south by:] Yellowstone
::[A small fragment off the southen part of the western edge, an arrow and a label:] Chehalis/Black Lake

:[Nova Scotia, New Brunswick and parts of the adjacent US, disconnected by:] Champlain/Hudson
::[Label with an arrow on the east coast:] Cape Cod Canal

:[A small triangle of territory, further isolated by:] Erie

:[Most of the Eastern Seaboard of the US, additionally divided off by:] Tombigbee
::[Fragment of land shorn from the northern part of the eastern edge, label with arrow:] Chesapeake and Delaware Canal
::[Fragment of land shorn from the tip of Florida, label with arrow:] Okeechobee Waterway

:[Strip of land west of the Tombigbee, bounded also to its west by:] Mississippi
::[Fragment of land immediately to its south, with a nearby label and arrow:] Atchafalaya

:[The remainder of the continent; comprising much of the US, all of Mexico and various central American territories, with a final tip of the eastwards-bending isthmus:] Panama Canal

{{comic discussion}}
[[Category:Maps]]
[[Category:Comics with color]]
[[Category:Politics]]