explain xkcd - User contributions [en]

Talk:1248: Sphere

2013-08-08T12:20:12Z

Oscar:

More specifically,a geoid.--[[User:Guru-45|Guru-45]] ([[User talk:Guru-45|talk]]) 08:51, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:Astronomers observe objects in the sky, not the Earth.--[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 11:19, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
::Astronomers live on the surface of the Earth, not on the surface of the sky (celestial sphere). [[Special:Contributions/167.107.191.217|167.107.191.217]] 13:25, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Are you sure “Sphere” refers to “hemisphere” and not simply to earth? After all, she’s trapped on earth and not on the celestial sphere. [[User:Quoti|Quoti]] ([[User talk:Quoti|talk]]) 11:24, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:It's the hemisphere, see my comment above.--[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 11:46, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:: I'm assuming you're referring to the "light-sphere" whose origin lies at the astronomer's location, and thus the universe always being bigger than the places he can physically visit. Still though, the statement "They can't travel to the places they observe" isn't accurate. We've been to the moon for instance. And then of course, there are always the unknown unknowns of the universe and interstellar travel. [[Special:Contributions/220.224.246.97|220.224.246.97]] 12:19, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
::: The fact that we, the human race, have been to the moon is no comfort to anyone who's seen the wonders revealed by the HST (which isn't even suitable for inspecting the moon). We are, indeed, "trapped" here on Earth, into the foreseeable future. ''— [[User:Tbc|tbc]] ([[User talk:Tbc|talk]]) 13:22, 7 August 2013 (UTC)''
: I read it as earth. It's a sphere and we're all trapped on its surface and astronomy classes make you aware of this fact more than your everyday experiences. Also, doesn't "hemisphere" mean "half sphere"? like northern and southern hemisphere of the earth? [[User:Peter|Peter]] ([[User talk:Peter|talk]]) 12:48, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Do we maybe have a reference to [[1246]]? [[Special:Contributions/217.81.31.20|217.81.31.20]] 11:37, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:That comic belongs more to space science than to astronomers.--[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 11:46, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm sure the sphere is Earth. We don't live on the '''surface''' of the universe. Everybody in http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=104172 agrees. [[Special:Contributions/167.107.191.217|167.107.191.217]] 13:12, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

"This totally occupies her mind, and she feels frustrated that she can only learn about those mind-boggling places, and not visit them herself." Wow. She must have been in a class? She's "totally" occupied? She's frustrated? (Not wistful, or resigned, or just aware of a fact mind you.) She isn't just thinking about the size of space, but apparently really, really wants to actually travel there. (To where, exactly? What "mind boggling" places? "Space"? Seems rather general.) You got all that deep and specific feeling from just her using the word "trapped"? Looks like reading a lot into things, to me. [[User:CFoxx|CFoxx]] ([[User talk:CFoxx|talk]]) 15:53, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:I try to not to make the explanations too dry; they are and should often be interpretations to some extent. On the other hand yeah, you are probably right that I read too much emotion into it. I changed the things you commented on. –[[User:St.nerol|St.nerol]] ([[User talk:St.nerol|talk]]) 18:29, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:@CFoxx - Absolutely. In XKCD, there are no shades of grey. (really, look for yourself) [[User:JamesCurran|JamesCurran]] ([[User talk:JamesCurran|talk]]) 19:43, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Hey, what the hell are you doing? "The sphere she mentions..." is absolutely wrong, the word ''Sphere'' appears only at the title and the title text! Megan is just impressed by the vast size of the universe.--[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 16:21, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:And to all you ''Earth'' theorists, tell me why Randall mentions astronomers and NOT the entire mankind? And that, after Megan talks about a big universe. Astronomers do not observe the Earth but objects in that big universe, which is from a viewpoint on Earth just a sphere.--[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 16:21, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
::One more: Astronomers are not trapped to the surface of the Earth because they use many space telescopes even beyond of earth's orbit. They are also using probes at many planets and more all over the solar system.--[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 17:02, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:::Would you please look at the first panel … And just using space telescopes doesn’t mean you’re no longer trapped. Imagine yourself being trapped in a cage with a satellite dish to communicate with a space telescope (well … just imagine that). You’re not going anywhere by using that telescope. I think you confuse “being trapped” with “being limited”. Being trapped somewhere doesn’t mean your observation is limited to that place too. [[User:Quoti|Quoti]] ([[User talk:Quoti|talk]]) 17:54, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
::::Ok, I did ignore the first panel, sorry about that. But the Earth is a {{w|geoid}} and absolutely doesn't match the criteria for a {{w|sphere}}. So, like in democracy the mass does win, but I'm still sure I'm right.--[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 19:13, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:She does mention a sphere, so I changed it back. No hard feelings (I hope). –[[User:St.nerol|St.nerol]] ([[User talk:St.nerol|talk]]) 18:29, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
::I don't mind, but it seems I'm the only astronomer and physicist here.--[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 19:13, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

After some more thoughts on this, why nobody (even myself) did raise the idea that Randall talks about both interpretations? Nevertheless, if the sphere is interpreted as the surface of the Earth there is a need to explain the geoid discrepancy to an ideal sphere, as mentioned in the very first post here.--[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 19:51, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
:I fixed a sentence on the discrepancy (with some Wikipedia help). Interesting stuff! I think that Megan answers Cueballs question quite literary. How are you? Trapped on a 2-dimensional surface. The 'celestial sphere'-thing seems too far fetched... –[[User:St.nerol|St.nerol]] ([[User talk:St.nerol|talk]]) 10:54, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

This "a sphere is a surface and has no surface" is too much nitpicking. Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sphere) talks about calculating the surface area of a sphere. I think "surface of sth" is not very rigorously defined. Often two dimensional manifolds are called surfaces, and a sphere is one, and the surface (different meaning) of the earth is roughly a sphere. What a sphere doesn't have is a border. [[User:Peter|Peter]] ([[User talk:Peter|talk]]) 11:54, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

The is trapped on the surface of this sphere, since you can walk on it forever, without ever leaving it[[User:Oscar|Oscar]] ([[User talk:Oscar|talk]]) 12:20, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Talk:1113: Killed in Action

2012-11-13T13:02:39Z

Oscar:

The title text is essentially the beginning of the hanging paradox: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unexpected_hanging_paradox
:It's not quite the same--[[User:Joehammer79|Joehammer79]] ([[User talk:Joehammer79|talk]]) 17:03, 27 September 2012 (UTC) thing. The unexpected hanging paradox only applies when you have a measure of foreknowledge. [[User:Davidy22|Davidy22]] ([[User talk:Davidy22|talk]]) 05:50, 26 September 2012 (UTC)

I think there's also a strong indication that this is mocking cop films from the 80's/90's, such as Lethal Weapon, where a character would always die just before retirement.
--[[Special:Contributions/46.246.31.111|46.246.31.111]] 07:08, 26 September 2012 (UTC)

This one is a variant of the old Czech joke: "The study has proved that statistically the most casualties happen in the last car of a train. Therefore the committee suggests to make all trains one car shorter." --[[User:Mity|Mity]] ([[User talk:Mity|talk]]) 09:59, 26 September 2012 (UTC)

This comics's explanation is complete bollocks, I think. Of course it is NOT a "fact that such a room exists". This comics parodies trope often used in cop movies - an elderly cop goes to work for the last time before his retirement, packs things, plans fishing the next day ... only to be called to one more case (possibly with a new, young and brash partner). And despites his efforts not to screw anything and stay clear of danger, he is either mortally wounded or screws big time and is degraded. So much clichè, that if someone says "It's my last day or service", you might be sure one of the two options above happens. See http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Retirony for all the use cases and examples. [[User:Edheldil|Edheldil]] ([[User talk:Edheldil|talk]]) 10:25, 26 September 2012 (UTC)
:I added the tv trope to the explanation. Didn't even see your comment at first, but why didn't you just change and add to the explanation yourself? That would be the whole point of the wiki. --[[User:Buggz|Buggz]] ([[User talk:Buggz|talk]]) 10:34, 26 September 2012 (UTC)

To add a little irony to the irony, the dead cop actually IS in a "locked, heavily guarded room." (There's a Sufi story along those lines.) The real solution to the retirony risk would be for their retirement day to fall within a 12 month window, chosen by some randomly generated number chosen before the shift begins. Thus they could avoid building up a hazardous "retirony field" focused around the point-source retirement day. Sort of like this thing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona_ring [[User:Noni Mausa|Noni Mausa]] ([[User talk:Noni Mausa|talk]]) 12:11, 26 September 2012 (UTC)
:...But that doesn't eliminate the "retirony field", it only dispurses it over a larger area. The retirony claim would shift to "(s)he was due to retire this year" times the number of retirees within that retirement window. Assuming these tragic events are "uniformly distributed" the probability they'll happen will be present right up to the end of one's active tour of duty, no matter what. Shorten the train, indeed. :) -- [[User:IronyChef|IronyChef]] ([[User talk:IronyChef|talk]]) 14:29, 26 September 2012 (UTC)
::How about simply not planning your retirement at all, and instead just spontaneously quitting at some point? [[User:Erenan|Erenan]] ([[User talk:Erenan|talk]]) 15:38, 27 September 2012 (UTC)
:::Yeah, that would work. Writing it into a collective agreement might be a bit iffy...[[User:Noni Mausa|Noni Mausa]] ([[User talk:Noni Mausa|talk]]) 11:20, 28 September 2012 (UTC)
:Alternative route: declare someones retirement '''on the day of their retirement'''. Make sure to forbid them in the day of their retirement from taking any missions, no matter how much they need the cop! [[User:Greyson|Greyson]] ([[User talk:Greyson|talk]]) 15:17, 2 November 2012 (UTC)
:That would not work. Working on Dec 30th, you would know for sure that Dec 31st would be your retirement date. So you cannot retire on Dec 31st. With that in mind: working on Dec 29th, you would know for sure that Dec 30th would be your retirement date. With that in mind: working on Dec 28th, you would know for sure that Dec 29th would be your retirement date. With that in mind.... --[[User:Oscar|Oscar]] ([[User talk:Oscar|talk]]) 13:02, 13 November 2012 (UTC)
An unstated but related phenomenon is "[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias Confirmation Bias], where something significant stands out in our mind, causing us to overreact or use bad judgement. In this case, the confirmation bias makes it seem like cops are always killed on their last day, so they create such a room.
:Actually, all cops who are killed on the job are killed on their last day!
::Not necessary true in all movies. Detective [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marty_Hopkirk Marty Hopkirk], for example, continued fighting crime after dead. [http://hellsing.wikia.com/wiki/Seras_Victoria Seras Victoria] changed the classical police officer uniform for a special force one but was still reffered as "police girl". I'm sure there are more examples. -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 08:16, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

Talk:1113: Killed in Action

2012-09-28T12:06:03Z

Oscar:

The title text is essentially the beginning of the hanging paradox: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unexpected_hanging_paradox
:It's not quite the same--[[User:Joehammer79|Joehammer79]] ([[User talk:Joehammer79|talk]]) 17:03, 27 September 2012 (UTC) thing. The unexpected hanging paradox only applies when you have a measure of foreknowledge. [[User:Davidy22|Davidy22]] ([[User talk:Davidy22|talk]]) 05:50, 26 September 2012 (UTC)

I think there's also a strong indication that this is mocking cop films from the 80's/90's, such as Lethal Weapon, where a character would always die just before retirement.
--[[Special:Contributions/46.246.31.111|46.246.31.111]] 07:08, 26 September 2012 (UTC)

This one is a variant of the old Czech joke: "The study has proved that statistically the most casualties happen in the last car of a train. Therefore the committee suggests to make all trains one car shorter." --[[User:Mity|Mity]] ([[User talk:Mity|talk]]) 09:59, 26 September 2012 (UTC)

This comics's explanation is complete bollocks, I think. Of course it is NOT a "fact that such a room exists". This comics parodies trope often used in cop movies - an elderly cop goes to work for the last time before his retirement, packs things, plans fishing the next day ... only to be called to one more case (possibly with a new, young and brash partner). And despites his efforts not to screw anything and stay clear of danger, he is either mortally wounded or screws big time and is degraded. So much clichè, that if someone says "It's my last day or service", you might be sure one of the two options above happens. See http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Retirony for all the use cases and examples. [[User:Edheldil|Edheldil]] ([[User talk:Edheldil|talk]]) 10:25, 26 September 2012 (UTC)
:I added the tv trope to the explanation. Didn't even see your comment at first, but why didn't you just change and add to the explanation yourself? That would be the whole point of the wiki. --[[User:Buggz|Buggz]] ([[User talk:Buggz|talk]]) 10:34, 26 September 2012 (UTC)

To add a little irony to the irony, the dead cop actually IS in a "locked, heavily guarded room." (There's a Sufi story along those lines.) The real solution to the retirony risk would be for their retirement day to fall within a 12 month window, chosen by some randomly generated number chosen before the shift begins. Thus they could avoid building up a hazardous "retirony field" focused around the point-source retirement day. Sort of like this thing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona_ring [[User:Noni Mausa|Noni Mausa]] ([[User talk:Noni Mausa|talk]]) 12:11, 26 September 2012 (UTC)
:...But that doesn't eliminate the "retirony field", it only dispurses it over a larger area. The retirony claim would shift to "(s)he was due to retire this year" times the number of retirees within that retirement window. Assuming these tragic events are "uniformly distributed" the probability they'll happen will be present right up to the end of one's active tour of duty, no matter what. Shorten the train, indeed. :) -- [[User:IronyChef|IronyChef]] ([[User talk:IronyChef|talk]]) 14:29, 26 September 2012 (UTC)
::How about simply not planning your retirement at all, and instead just spontaneously quitting at some point? [[User:Erenan|Erenan]] ([[User talk:Erenan|talk]]) 15:38, 27 September 2012 (UTC)
:::Yeah, that would work. Writing it into a collective agreement might be a bit iffy...[[User:Noni Mausa|Noni Mausa]] ([[User talk:Noni Mausa|talk]]) 11:20, 28 September 2012 (UTC)
:That would not work. Working on Dec 30th, you would know for sure that Dec 31st would be your retirement date. So you cannot retire on Dec 31st. With that in mind: working on Dec 29th, you would know for sure that Dec 30th would be your retirement date. With that in mind: working on Dec 28th, you would know for sure that Dec 29th would be your retirement date. With that in mind....
An unstated but related phenomenon is "[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias Confirmation Bias], where something significant stands out in our mind, causing us to overreact or use bad judgement. In this case, the confirmation bias makes it seem like cops are always killed on their last day, so they create such a room.