1366: Train - Revision history

42.book.addict: rv vandalism

2025-04-09T00:19:01Z

rv vandalism

104.23.187.48: /* Explanation */

2025-04-09T00:03:13Z

‎Explanation

172.70.207.29: Replaced fictional forces with fictitious forces

2025-01-18T18:12:12Z

Replaced fictional forces with fictitious forces

172.70.206.54: Removed the "the" before "Newtonian mechanics"

2025-01-18T18:09:58Z

Removed the "the" before "Newtonian mechanics"

172.70.206.55: Capitalized the N in Newtonian mechanics

2025-01-18T18:09:20Z

Capitalized the N in Newtonian mechanics

172.71.254.34: Changing the reference changes the physics, so yes, the train really IS powerful enough to move the Earth.

2024-07-03T19:09:24Z

Changing the reference changes the physics, so yes, the train really IS powerful enough to move the Earth.

42.book.addict at 00:33, 2 March 2024

2024-03-02T00:33:26Z

108.162.245.37 at 00:29, 2 March 2024

2024-03-02T00:29:02Z

SilverTheTerribleMathematician: /* Explanation */

2022-12-15T15:02:19Z

‎Explanation

141.101.99.31: Undo revision 300790 by 162.158.106.20 (talk)

2022-12-08T03:18:01Z

Undo revision 300790 by 162.158.106.20 (talk)

@@ Line 7: / Line 7: @@
 }}
-ORCS
+==Explanation==
 ==Transcript==

@@ Line 7: / Line 7: @@
 }}
-==Explanation==
+ORCS
 ==Transcript==

@@ Line 12: / Line 12: @@
 Rather than viewing this situation as a train causing itself to move relative to an immobile Earth, [[Randall]] provides the unconventional perspective of a train remaining fixed in space while causing the Earth itself and all the stars in the sky to rotate instead. In principle either perspective is equally valid — though in practice different trains often move in mutually-exclusive directions, thus each train would have to define its own frame of reference. It is said that Einstein once asked a ticket collector, "What time does Oxford stop at this train?"
-From the Newtonian perspective this choice of frame is valid, but results in unnecessarily complicated math; the equation of motion would include terms for centrifugal, Coriolis and other so-called {{w|Inertial force|"fictional forces"}} (see [[123: Centrifugal Force]]). {{w|Isaac Newton|Newton}} supposes the existence of "inertial frames", in which these forces are zero, and the surface of the Earth approximates an inertial frame well. In General Relativity, the presence of mass in a system curves the {{w|spacetime}} around of it. The train-earth system could be modeled in general relativity, taking the train as fixed. However the resulting equations would be complex, and not amenable to an exact solution.
+From the Newtonian perspective this choice of frame is valid, but results in unnecessarily complicated math; the equation of motion would include terms for centrifugal, Coriolis and other so-called {{w|Inertial force|"fictitious forces"}} (see [[123: Centrifugal Force]]). {{w|Isaac Newton|Newton}} supposes the existence of "inertial frames", in which these forces are zero, and the surface of the Earth approximates an inertial frame well. In General Relativity, the presence of mass in a system curves the {{w|spacetime}} around of it. The train-earth system could be modeled in general relativity, taking the train as fixed. However the resulting equations would be complex, and not amenable to an exact solution.
 The title text expands on this to include elevators, which change a person's position relative to the center of the Earth. From a passenger's perspective, it would appear as though the Earth's position was instead being changed in space.

@@ Line 8: / Line 8: @@
 ==Explanation==
-This comic, which appeared the day before {{w|National Train Day}}, plays on the fact that a choice of a {{w|Inertial frame of reference|reference frame}} is arbitrary, leading to the {{w|Principle of relativity|"Principle of relativity"}} in {{w|Albert Einstein}}'s theories of {{w|special relativity}} and {{w|general relativity}}. But at speeds much lower than the speed of light it also applies to the {{w|Classical mechanics|Newtonian mechanics}}.
+This comic, which appeared the day before {{w|National Train Day}}, plays on the fact that a choice of a {{w|Inertial frame of reference|reference frame}} is arbitrary, leading to the {{w|Principle of relativity|"Principle of relativity"}} in {{w|Albert Einstein}}'s theories of {{w|special relativity}} and {{w|general relativity}}. But at speeds much lower than the speed of light it also applies to {{w|Classical mechanics|Newtonian mechanics}}.
 Rather than viewing this situation as a train causing itself to move relative to an immobile Earth, [[Randall]] provides the unconventional perspective of a train remaining fixed in space while causing the Earth itself and all the stars in the sky to rotate instead. In principle either perspective is equally valid — though in practice different trains often move in mutually-exclusive directions, thus each train would have to define its own frame of reference. It is said that Einstein once asked a ticket collector, "What time does Oxford stop at this train?"

@@ Line 8: / Line 8: @@
 ==Explanation==
-This comic, which appeared the day before {{w|National Train Day}}, plays on the fact that a choice of a {{w|Inertial frame of reference|reference frame}} is arbitrary, leading to the {{w|Principle of relativity|"Principle of relativity"}} in {{w|Albert Einstein}}'s theories of {{w|special relativity}} and {{w|general relativity}}. But at speeds much lower than the speed of light it also applies to the {{w|Classical mechanics|newtonian mechanics}}.
+This comic, which appeared the day before {{w|National Train Day}}, plays on the fact that a choice of a {{w|Inertial frame of reference|reference frame}} is arbitrary, leading to the {{w|Principle of relativity|"Principle of relativity"}} in {{w|Albert Einstein}}'s theories of {{w|special relativity}} and {{w|general relativity}}. But at speeds much lower than the speed of light it also applies to the {{w|Classical mechanics|Newtonian mechanics}}.
 Rather than viewing this situation as a train causing itself to move relative to an immobile Earth, [[Randall]] provides the unconventional perspective of a train remaining fixed in space while causing the Earth itself and all the stars in the sky to rotate instead. In principle either perspective is equally valid — though in practice different trains often move in mutually-exclusive directions, thus each train would have to define its own frame of reference. It is said that Einstein once asked a ticket collector, "What time does Oxford stop at this train?"

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:09, 3 July 2024
Line 11:		Line 11:

	Rather than viewing this situation as a train causing itself to move relative to an immobile Earth, [[Randall]] provides the unconventional perspective of a train remaining fixed in space while causing the Earth itself and all the stars in the sky to rotate instead. In principle either perspective is equally valid — though in practice different trains often move in mutually-exclusive directions, thus each train would have to define its own frame of reference. It is said that Einstein once asked a ticket collector, "What time does Oxford stop at this train?"		Rather than viewing this situation as a train causing itself to move relative to an immobile Earth, [[Randall]] provides the unconventional perspective of a train remaining fixed in space while causing the Earth itself and all the stars in the sky to rotate instead. In principle either perspective is equally valid — though in practice different trains often move in mutually-exclusive directions, thus each train would have to define its own frame of reference. It is said that Einstein once asked a ticket collector, "What time does Oxford stop at this train?"
−
−	Changing the reference frame into the inside of the train only means that you see the outside world in a different reference, since the train doesn't really move the Earth{{Citation needed}} (the train's engine and the friction of the wheels aren't even remotely powerful enough) it simply appears that way from the inside.

	From the Newtonian perspective this choice of frame is valid, but results in unnecessarily complicated math; the equation of motion would include terms for centrifugal, Coriolis and other so-called {{w\|Inertial force\|"fictional forces"}} (see [[123: Centrifugal Force]]). {{w\|Isaac Newton\|Newton}} supposes the existence of "inertial frames", in which these forces are zero, and the surface of the Earth approximates an inertial frame well. In General Relativity, the presence of mass in a system curves the {{w\|spacetime}} around of it. The train-earth system could be modeled in general relativity, taking the train as fixed. However the resulting equations would be complex, and not amenable to an exact solution.		From the Newtonian perspective this choice of frame is valid, but results in unnecessarily complicated math; the equation of motion would include terms for centrifugal, Coriolis and other so-called {{w\|Inertial force\|"fictional forces"}} (see [[123: Centrifugal Force]]). {{w\|Isaac Newton\|Newton}} supposes the existence of "inertial frames", in which these forces are zero, and the surface of the Earth approximates an inertial frame well. In General Relativity, the presence of mass in a system curves the {{w\|spacetime}} around of it. The train-earth system could be modeled in general relativity, taking the train as fixed. However the resulting equations would be complex, and not amenable to an exact solution.

@@ Line 4: / Line 4: @@
 | title     = Train
 | image     = train.png
-| titletext = Trains rotate the Soviet Union around various axes while elevators shift its position in space.
+| titletext = Trains rotate the Earth around various axes while elevators shift its position in space.
 }}