3031: Time Capsule Instructions - Revision history

141.101.98.55 at 00:58, 15 January 2025

2025-01-15T00:58:16Z

141.101.98.240: /* Explanation */ Happy New Year, Foula!

2025-01-14T13:28:10Z

‎Explanation: Happy New Year, Foula!

172.70.38.47: /* Potential solutions */

2025-01-12T03:31:20Z

‎Potential solutions

Apollo11: Just gonna go do that 2x Hope it’s not too late!

2025-01-08T22:27:47Z

Just gonna go do that 2x Hope it’s not too late!

172.69.246.151: grammar

2025-01-08T02:14:44Z

grammar

172.68.55.81: grammar error

2025-01-02T13:53:00Z

grammar error

172.69.43.243: /* Potential solutions */ Combined the 'repeated' suggestion into the one before that it was almost copying, and slight technical changes and rewordings elsewhere.

2025-01-01T16:15:49Z

‎Potential solutions: Combined the 'repeated' suggestion into the one before that it was almost copying, and slight technical changes and rewordings elsewhere.

172.71.254.250: /* Potential solutions */

2025-01-01T15:17:47Z

‎Potential solutions

Someyearsago-nevermindhowlongprecisely: /* Potential solutions */

2025-01-01T05:56:32Z

‎Potential solutions

Someyearsago-nevermindhowlongprecisely: Added own solution and speculation about a possible fourth box

2025-01-01T05:43:16Z

Added own solution and speculation about a possible fourth box

@@ Line 27: / Line 27: @@
 Depending on interpretation, you could defeat the third box by placing it inside two time zones at once before opening it, as there is no time limit on the third box. This works if the instruction on the box is read as "unless you are in the time zone where you opened the first box, and you are in the time zone where you opened the second box". However, this new loophole could be patched by interpreting the third box as "unless you are in the ''one'' time zone where...".
-How to be considered to be simultaneously covered by two time-zones (in a way that you can [[2846: Daylight Saving Choice|choose which to observe]]) is left up to the reader, although another variation of this solution would be to change the https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crl3grgg9zeo calendar used as point of reference, as {{w|Calendar era|many calendars}} use a lower year than the Gregorian calendar, or is [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crl3grgg9zeo offset by a few days], and you could justify changing the date (if not the hour) that you consider true. Or perhaps mix and match calendar traditions that consider a day (and therefore a calendar date) to start only at dawn, rather than at astronomical/geopolitical midnight.
+How to be considered to be simultaneously covered by two time-zones (in a way that you can [[2846: Daylight Saving Choice|choose which to observe]]) is left up to the reader, although another variation of this solution would be to change the calendar used as point of reference, as {{w|Calendar era|many calendars}} use a lower year than the Gregorian calendar, or is [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crl3grgg9zeo offset by a few days], and you could justify changing the date (if not the hour) that you consider true. Or perhaps mix and match calendar traditions that consider a day (and therefore a calendar date) to start only at dawn, rather than at astronomical/geopolitical midnight.
 Perhaps the solution would be for both the box and the person opening it to be on the boundary between two time zones, half in each. Or, depending on how one interprets the nature of Daylight Saving Time, there may be another solution. In Australia, {{w|Northern Territory}} and {{w|South Australia}} are in the same time zone (by the most common interpretation of the word) and border each other, but only the latter uses Daylight Saving Time; similarly, {{w|Queensland}} does not use Daylight Saving Time but is in the same time zone (by the most common interpretation of the word) as multiple Australian territories that do use Daylight Saving Time, including {{w|New South Wales}}, with which Queensland shares a border. This suggests the idea of opening the first box in South Australia or New South Wales then taking it north of the (latitudinal) DST boundary without crossing any (longitudinal) time zone boundaries; one will then have up to an hour to open the second box and then as long as one wants to open the third box. However, Randall [[:Category:Daylight saving time|has historically expressed opposition to Daylight Saving Time]], so he might not count the first opening as occurring in 2025 if that year has already started only by virtue of Daylight Saving Time.

@@ Line 27: / Line 27: @@
 Depending on interpretation, you could defeat the third box by placing it inside two time zones at once before opening it, as there is no time limit on the third box. This works if the instruction on the box is read as "unless you are in the time zone where you opened the first box, and you are in the time zone where you opened the second box". However, this new loophole could be patched by interpreting the third box as "unless you are in the ''one'' time zone where...".
-How to be considered to be simultaneously covered by two time-zones (in a way that you can [[2846: Daylight Saving Choice|choose which to observe]]) is left up to the reader, although another variation of this solution would be to change the calendar used as point of reference, as {{w|Calendar era|many calendars}} use a lower year than the Gregorian calendar, and you could justify changing the date (if not the hour) that you consider true. Or perhaps mix and match calendar traditions that consider a day (and therefore a calendar date) to start only at dawn, rather than at astronomical/geopolitical midnight.
+How to be considered to be simultaneously covered by two time-zones (in a way that you can [[2846: Daylight Saving Choice|choose which to observe]]) is left up to the reader, although another variation of this solution would be to change the https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crl3grgg9zeo calendar used as point of reference, as {{w|Calendar era|many calendars}} use a lower year than the Gregorian calendar, or is [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crl3grgg9zeo offset by a few days], and you could justify changing the date (if not the hour) that you consider true. Or perhaps mix and match calendar traditions that consider a day (and therefore a calendar date) to start only at dawn, rather than at astronomical/geopolitical midnight.
 Perhaps the solution would be for both the box and the person opening it to be on the boundary between two time zones, half in each. Or, depending on how one interprets the nature of Daylight Saving Time, there may be another solution. In Australia, {{w|Northern Territory}} and {{w|South Australia}} are in the same time zone (by the most common interpretation of the word) and border each other, but only the latter uses Daylight Saving Time; similarly, {{w|Queensland}} does not use Daylight Saving Time but is in the same time zone (by the most common interpretation of the word) as multiple Australian territories that do use Daylight Saving Time, including {{w|New South Wales}}, with which Queensland shares a border. This suggests the idea of opening the first box in South Australia or New South Wales then taking it north of the (latitudinal) DST boundary without crossing any (longitudinal) time zone boundaries; one will then have up to an hour to open the second box and then as long as one wants to open the third box. However, Randall [[:Category:Daylight saving time|has historically expressed opposition to Daylight Saving Time]], so he might not count the first opening as occurring in 2025 if that year has already started only by virtue of Daylight Saving Time.

@@ Line 27: / Line 27: @@
 Depending on interpretation, you could defeat the third box by placing it inside two time zones at once before opening it, as there is no time limit on the third box. This works if the instruction on the box is read as "unless you are in the time zone where you opened the first box, and you are in the time zone where you opened the second box". However, this new loophole could be patched by interpreting the third box as "unless you are in the ''one'' time zone where...".
-How to be considered to be simultaneously covered by two time-zones (in a way that you can [[2846: Daylight Saving Choice|choose which to observe]] is left up to the reader, although another variation of this solution would be to change the calendar used as point of reference, as {{w|Calendar era|many calendars}} use a lower year than the Gregorian calendar, and you could justify changing the date (if not the hour) that you consider true. Or perhaps mix and match calendar traditions that consider a day (and therefore a calendar date) to start only at dawn, rather than at astronomical/geopolitical midnight.
+How to be considered to be simultaneously covered by two time-zones (in a way that you can [[2846: Daylight Saving Choice|choose which to observe]]) is left up to the reader, although another variation of this solution would be to change the calendar used as point of reference, as {{w|Calendar era|many calendars}} use a lower year than the Gregorian calendar, and you could justify changing the date (if not the hour) that you consider true. Or perhaps mix and match calendar traditions that consider a day (and therefore a calendar date) to start only at dawn, rather than at astronomical/geopolitical midnight.
 Perhaps the solution would be for both the box and the person opening it to be on the boundary between two time zones, half in each. Or, depending on how one interprets the nature of Daylight Saving Time, there may be another solution. In Australia, {{w|Northern Territory}} and {{w|South Australia}} are in the same time zone (by the most common interpretation of the word) and border each other, but only the latter uses Daylight Saving Time; similarly, {{w|Queensland}} does not use Daylight Saving Time but is in the same time zone (by the most common interpretation of the word) as multiple Australian territories that do use Daylight Saving Time, including {{w|New South Wales}}, with which Queensland shares a border. This suggests the idea of opening the first box in South Australia or New South Wales then taking it north of the (latitudinal) DST boundary without crossing any (longitudinal) time zone boundaries; one will then have up to an hour to open the second box and then as long as one wants to open the third box. However, Randall [[:Category:Daylight saving time|has historically expressed opposition to Daylight Saving Time]], so he might not count the first opening as occurring in 2025 if that year has already started only by virtue of Daylight Saving Time.

@@ Line 10: / Line 10: @@
 ==Explanation==
-{{incomplete|Created by an ANNUAL TIME CAPSULE SUBSCRIPTION - Please change this comment when editing this page. Do NOT delete this tag too soon. Do NOT delete this tag too late either.}}
 This [[:Category:New Year|New Year comic]] sees a New Year party held at a location where a {{w|time capsule}} has clearly been buried, as evidenced by a sign marking the spot. It is likely that this was buried some years ago with the intention of being unearthed at the start of 2025, after some significant number of years have passed, rather than for an indeterminate amount of time (such as was the case in [[1617: Time Capsule]]), with the intent to allow people of a then-future time see what those of that era found interesting to preserve and "send" into the future.

@@ Line 17: / Line 17: @@
 Not all such projects are kept conspicuously marked, or may lose their signage due to circumstances unanticipated at the time of the original installation, resulting in a surprise (or accidental) unearthing, while others may still be known for what they are (as with the intended time to stay closed) but need to be relocated/reconcealed due to later redevelopment of the location. (There is generally nothing to prevent premature unearthing and opening, perhaps especially to ensure that the contents are not damaged, but often {{w|Blue Peter#Time capsules|efforts are taken}} to best adhere to the original wishes.) To this end, as might be expected of such a time capsule, the box that Ponytail digs out is itself marked that it must not be opened until the year 2025 and it seems that (for the comic) this is the case, and at least part of the reason for the gathering.
-Within the capsule, however, is a second container (a not untypical precaution), but this one has the instruction to not open after 2024, which is a far less obvious element for a time capsule (though various supplies, from [[2178: Expiration Date High Score|packaged food]] to [[2297: Use or Discard By|signal flares]], may have a similar requirement). Obeying the instruction for opening the first box has entirely precluded obeying that given as a prerequisite for opening the second... at least without using some form of time-travel. This could be either be a mundane twist of the circumstances (changing reference calendars or time-zones), or else require actual time-travel, but it is unlikely that they have [[1203: Time Machines|any practical solution]] prepared to use to overcome this twist.
+Within the capsule, however, is a second container (a not atypical precaution), but this one has the instruction to not open after 2024, which is a far less obvious element for a time capsule (though various supplies, from [[2178: Expiration Date High Score|packaged food]] to [[2297: Use or Discard By|signal flares]], may have a similar requirement). Obeying the instruction for opening the first box has entirely precluded obeying that given as a prerequisite for opening the second... at least without using some form of time-travel. This could be either be a mundane twist of the circumstances (changing reference calendars or time-zones), or else require actual time-travel, but it is unlikely that they have [[1203: Time Machines|any practical solution]] prepared to use to overcome this twist.
 The title text makes the situation more similar to {{w|Matryoshka dolls}}, where boxes are recursively stacked, with a third label having another restriction. This new label alludes to one of the ways one can open the first two boxes without ignoring the instructions: by crossing time zones. When more easterly-referenced locations have become the 1st of January 2025, it will (for a short while) still be the 31st of December 2024 in more westerly ones (the boundaries themselves might be any orientation, not just north-south; the whole concept inverts across the International Date Line, before even considering hour-shift differences), meaning that theoretically someone could open the first box in a time zone where it is 2025 and then quickly travel to one in which it is still 2024 to open the second box. Depending upon where the capsule was located, timely travel opportunities ''may'' be possible, but it seems unlikely to have been something anticipated by the recipients of the task.

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 Some of the above solutions might only be used if you already knew of the instructions on the boxes, unless it was previously dug into one of the relevant locations (and, depending upon the 'author' of the box-puzzle, this may have also been anticipated and be an intended part of the puzzle). Even getting the second box open following instructions would require it was possible to travel fast enough and far enough to reach a second New Year, which is not easily guaranteeable on the spur of the moment. This is definitely possible if you plan for it, but whether this disinterment party was prepared is unlikely.
-Having made the initial two openings in different locations, another possibility is to choose either location (e.g. remain where you were allowed to open the second box) and, with the third box removed/accessible, close the box that is out-of-zone. Creatively interpreting its own probibition as no longer relevant, trivially re-open that box to fulfil the requirements of the third.
+Having made the initial two openings in different locations, another possibility is to choose either location (it being easiest to remain where you were allowed to open the second box) and having removed all boxes from any prior host containers, close the box that is now out-of-zone. You can now either take the box's mandate as dealt with, and expired, or avoid any quibbles by waiting just long enough for the now-closed 2025 box to once more experience 2025 in the second box's locale, permiting you to re-open it and fulfil the requirements of the third.
-A similar approach requiring less creativity is to remove the third box from the other two and remain in the second location (initially 2024) until 2025. Then the first box could be closed and re-opened without disregarding its requirement. Since both the first and second boxes would have been opened in that timezone (even though the first box would have also been opened elsewhere), the requirement on the set-aside third box would then be satisfied. This requires no reinterpretation for multiple-timezone openings, and only assumes that the third box is freely separable from the second one.
+In any case it seems more likely that normal people, having taken the initial instruction at its word, would ignore any new [[2841: Sign Combo|contradictory rules]]. The original rule that the Time Capsule should remain closed until 2025 is the one that makes sense. So after opening the first at the right time, one could just disregard the words on the boxes (or at least Randall's interpretation of them); there is probably not some kind of [[242: The Difference|magical enforcement mechanism]]. Also it seems likely this was just a prank so there will be nothing interesting inside, but one might fear some kind of booby trap, or a [[325: A-Minus-Minus|bobcat]]. So there could be some kind of enforcement mechanism.
-In any case it seems more likely that normal people, having taken the initial instruction at its word, you would ignore any new [[2841: Sign Combo|contradictory rules]]. The original rule that the Time Capsule should remain closed until 2025 is the one that makes sense. So after opening the first at the right time, one could just disregard the words on the boxes (or at least Randall's interpretation of them); there is probably not some kind of [[242: The Difference|magical enforcement mechanism]]. Also it seems likely this was just a prank so there will be nothing interesting inside, but one might fear some kind of booby trap, or a [[325: A-Minus-Minus|bobcat]]. So there could be some kind of enforcement mechanism.
+Considering when the comic was published, however, a full day prior to ''any'' territory having actually celebrated the arrival of 2025, one might imagine that this is ''not'' an upcoming scenario, but one that has happened/is happening already. In this case, it suggests that the party (both diggers-up and associated party-goers) were fully aware of some of the stipulations they were to be subject to and (impatiently, or at even just as cleverly as the initial burier of the boxes) arbitrarily marked the arrival of 2025 ''early'' to 'justify' the opening the outer box. They could then conveniently reconsider their schedule, continuing now on the basis of acting prior to the end of 2024, and have no further trouble with either of the inner instructions (opening the next box before the ''official'' arrival of 2025 would be simplicity, and any antecedent calendar reinterpretations could be considered logically separated from any prohibitive change in location and/or time-zone).
 There is also the question of a hypothetical fourth box, which, given that there was a third box, there is no reason that there shouldn't be a fourth, probably with a label designed to better shut down some of these potential solutions. And maybe it's [[1557: Ozymandias|boxes all the way down]]!

@@ Line 39: / Line 39: @@
 In any case it seems more likely that normal people, having taken the initial instruction at its word, you would ignore any new [[2841: Sign Combo|contradictory rules]]. The original rule that the Time Capsule should remain closed until 2025 is the one that makes sense. So after opening the first at the right time, one could just disregard the words on the boxes (or at least Randall's interpretation of them); there is probably not some kind of [[242: The Difference|magical enforcement mechanism]]. Also it seems likely this was just a prank so there will be nothing interesting inside, but one might fear some kind of booby trap, or a [[325: A-Minus-Minus|bobcat]]. So there could be some kind of enforcement mechanism.
-Consider when the comic was published, however, well prior to any territory having actually celebrated the arrival of 2025. It is also possible that the depicted party (both diggers-up and associated party-goers) were fully aware of the stipulations they were to be subject to and (at least equally as slyly as the boxes-burier) marked the arrival of 2025 ''early''. Having self-justifying themselves for the opening the outer box, they could then conveniently reconsider themselves to be rightfully still at an occasion back at the end of 2024 and have no further trouble with either of the inner instructions, assuming they opened the next box before the ''official'' arrival of 2025.<!-- Yes, they are perhaps also at as much liberty to 'reimagine' it being 2024-or-earlier, at will, later on as required. But semanticallly a bit-of-advanced-2025 flummary might indeed count as the necessary arrival of 2025, yet the true-close-of-2024 might firmly shut the gate on being considering the rest of the future being after-2024. This is all a stretch, I really just wanted to point out the choice of publishing this on 2024-12-30, not 2025-01-01, which would have made this less obvious. It's all loophole-finding, anyway. There is also the question of a hypothetical fourth box, which, given that there was a third box, there is no reason that there shouldn't be a fourth, probably with a label designed to better shut down some of these potential solutions. And maybe it's [[1557: Ozymandias|boxes all the way down]]!-->
+Consider when the comic was published, however, well prior to any territory having actually celebrated the arrival of 2025. It is also possible that the depicted party (both diggers-up and associated party-goers) were fully aware of the stipulations they were to be subject to and (at least equally as slyly as the boxes-burier) marked the arrival of 2025 ''early''. Having self-justifying themselves for the opening the outer box, they could then conveniently reconsider themselves to be rightfully still at an occasion back at the end of 2024 and have no further trouble with either of the inner instructions, assuming they opened the next box before the ''official'' arrival of 2025.<!-- Yes, they are perhaps also at as much liberty to 'reimagine' it being 2024-or-earlier, at will, later on as required. But semanticallly a bit-of-advanced-2025 flummary might indeed count as the necessary arrival of 2025, yet the true-close-of-2024 might firmly shut the gate on being considering the rest of the future being after-2024. This is all a stretch, I really just wanted to point out the choice of publishing this on 2024-12-30, not 2025-01-01, which would have made this less obvious. It's all loophole-finding, anyway.!-->
 ==Transcript==