Talk:2878: Supernova - Revision history

162.158.129.166 at 13:07, 28 February 2025

2025-02-28T13:07:56Z

172.69.22.242 at 21:57, 9 January 2024

2024-01-09T21:57:35Z

Transgalactic at 21:43, 9 January 2024

2024-01-09T21:43:06Z

172.70.91.11 at 19:02, 9 January 2024

2024-01-09T19:02:50Z

172.69.22.51: Relativity matters

2024-01-09T18:44:33Z

Relativity matters

172.69.23.117: Relativity matters

2024-01-09T18:42:50Z

Relativity matters

Firestar233: comment

2024-01-09T17:49:32Z

comment

172.70.91.211: or not, idk

2024-01-09T15:40:54Z

or not, idk

172.70.210.40 at 12:31, 9 January 2024

2024-01-09T12:31:57Z

RIIW - Ponder it at 08:33, 9 January 2024

2024-01-09T08:33:39Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:07, 28 February 2025
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	isn't the chart missing an uptick to the right? wouldn't the appearance of a supernova at, say, 13.6bn light years away make astronomers ''extremely'' happy? --[[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.211\|172.70.91.211]] 15:40, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		isn't the chart missing an uptick to the right? wouldn't the appearance of a supernova at, say, 13.6bn light years away make astronomers ''extremely'' happy? --[[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.211\|172.70.91.211]] 15:40, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
		+	:Yes, it is. There's hardly anything known beyond redshift ~2; if JWST somehow got spectra of a z ~ 7 supernova, maybe magnified by strong gravitational lensing, that would be an even higher uptick than the close SN one. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.129.166\|162.158.129.166]] 13:07, 28 February 2025 (UTC)

	The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233\|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233\|if you want to]] \| [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233\|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233\|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233\|if you want to]] \| [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233\|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

@@ Line 32: / Line 32: @@
 No.  It could not have already exploded.  This indicates a lack of understanding of relativity.  The more accurate statement would be that from our perspective, Betelgeuse hasn't exploded yet, and from the perspective of Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 700 years ago (local to earth), and from the midway point between Earth and Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 350 years ago (local to earth) and Betelgeuse is as it was 350 years ago (local to Betelgeuse).  Simultaneity changes with the perspective of the observer. {{unsigned ip|172.69.22.51|18:44, 9 January 2024}}
 :It is, however, possibly at the stage of "though we do not yet know it, we are to experience the signs of it having happened prior our own current time" (as in broadcasting "have you exploded yet?" would not have been answerable before it actually does, even if we somehow managed to do so several hundred years ago). But rewrite it as you see fit. I can see why the author of the current version decided not to go into that, and why you might be put off from trying to give the "more correct" version an airing through your own edit... [[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.11|172.70.91.11]] 19:02, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
 I just redacted much of the explanation because it was riddled with repetitions, errors and scientific imprecisions. (I didn't elaborate on the relativity issue, though, just added "locally" to that sentence.) I Hope you appreciate the result. [[User:Transgalactic|Transgalactic]] ([[User talk:Transgalactic|talk]]) 21:43, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

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 Anyone know of a recent event that could have inspired this comic? Betelgeuse is mentioned in the explanation but has there been any newsworthy supernovae in the past week? [[User:Alcatraz ii|Alcatraz ii]] ([[User talk:Alcatraz ii|talk]]) 05:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
 :[https://news.fnal.gov/2024/01/final-supernova-results-from-dark-energy-survey-offer-unique-insights-into-the-expansion-of-the-universe/ Maybe this?] [[Special:Contributions/172.70.210.40|172.70.210.40]] 12:31, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
 isn't the chart missing an uptick to the right? wouldn't the appearance of a supernova at, say, 13.6bn light years away make astronomers ''extremely'' happy? --[[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.211|172.70.91.211]] 15:40, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
 The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233|if you want to]] | [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
 No.  It could not have already exploded.  This indicates a lack of understanding of relativity.  The more accurate statement would be that from our perspective, Betelgeuse hasn't exploded yet, and from the perspective of Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 700 years ago (local to earth), and from the midway point between Earth and Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 350 years ago (local to earth) and Betelgeuse is as it was 350 years ago (local to Betelgeuse).  Simultaneity changes with the perspective of the observer. {{unsigned ip|172.69.22.51|18:44, 9 January 2024}}
 :It is, however, possibly at the stage of "though we do not yet know it, we are to experience the signs of it having happened prior our own current time" (as in broadcasting "have you exploded yet?" would not have been answerable before it actually does, even if we somehow managed to do so several hundred years ago). But rewrite it as you see fit. I can see why the author of the current version decided not to go into that, and why you might be put off from trying to give the "more correct" version an airing through your own edit... [[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.11|172.70.91.11]] 19:02, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:02, 9 January 2024
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	The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233\|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233\|if you want to]] \| [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233\|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233\|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233\|if you want to]] \| [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233\|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

−	No. It could not have already exploded. This indicates a lack of understanding of relativity. The more accurate statement would be that from our perspective, Betelgeuse hasn't exploded yet, and from the perspective of Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 700 years ago (local to earth), and from the midway point between Earth and Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 350 years ago (local to earth) and Betelgeuse is as it was 350 years ago (local to Betelgeuse). Simultaneity changes with the perspective of the observer.	+	No. It could not have already exploded. This indicates a lack of understanding of relativity. The more accurate statement would be that from our perspective, Betelgeuse hasn't exploded yet, and from the perspective of Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 700 years ago (local to earth), and from the midway point between Earth and Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 350 years ago (local to earth) and Betelgeuse is as it was 350 years ago (local to Betelgeuse). Simultaneity changes with the perspective of the observer. {{unsigned ip\|172.69.22.51\|18:44, 9 January 2024}}
		+	:It is, however, possibly at the stage of "though we do not yet know it, we are to experience the signs of it having happened prior our own current time" (as in broadcasting "have you exploded yet?" would not have been answerable before it actually does, even if we somehow managed to do so several hundred years ago). But rewrite it as you see fit. I can see why the author of the current version decided not to go into that, and why you might be put off from trying to give the "more correct" version an airing through your own edit... [[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.11\|172.70.91.11]] 19:02, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:44, 9 January 2024
Line 28:		Line 28:
	The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233\|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233\|if you want to]] \| [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233\|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233\|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233\|if you want to]] \| [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233\|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

−	No. It could not have already exploded. This indicates a lack of understanding of relativity. The more accurate statement would be that from our perspective, Betelgeuse hasn't exploded yet, and from the perspective of Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 700 years ago (local to earth), and from the midway point between Earth and Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 350 years ago (local to earth) and Betelgeuse is as it was 350 years ago (local to Betelgeuse). Simultaneity changes with the perspective of the observer, such that what we call now locally is what is happening to Betelgeuse 700 years ago from our perspective, and what we call now locally is what is happening 700 years in the future from the perspective of Betelgeuse, but since causality travels at the speed of the light, Betelgeuse has certainly not exploded yet, despite the distances between earth and Betelgeuse.	+	No. It could not have already exploded. This indicates a lack of understanding of relativity. The more accurate statement would be that from our perspective, Betelgeuse hasn't exploded yet, and from the perspective of Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 700 years ago (local to earth), and from the midway point between Earth and Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 350 years ago (local to earth) and Betelgeuse is as it was 350 years ago (local to Betelgeuse). Simultaneity changes with the perspective of the observer.

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:42, 9 January 2024
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	The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233\|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233\|if you want to]] \| [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233\|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233\|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233\|if you want to]] \| [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233\|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
		+
		+	No. It could not have already exploded. This indicates a lack of understanding of relativity. The more accurate statement would be that from our perspective, Betelgeuse hasn't exploded yet, and from the perspective of Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 700 years ago (local to earth), and from the midway point between Earth and Betelgeuse, Earth is as it was 350 years ago (local to earth) and Betelgeuse is as it was 350 years ago (local to Betelgeuse). Simultaneity changes with the perspective of the observer, such that what we call now locally is what is happening to Betelgeuse 700 years ago from our perspective, and what we call now locally is what is happening 700 years in the future from the perspective of Betelgeuse, but since causality travels at the speed of the light, Betelgeuse has certainly not exploded yet, despite the distances between earth and Betelgeuse.

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:49, 9 January 2024
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	isn't the chart missing an uptick to the right? wouldn't the appearance of a supernova at, say, 13.6bn light years away make astronomers ''extremely'' happy? --[[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.211\|172.70.91.211]] 15:40, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		isn't the chart missing an uptick to the right? wouldn't the appearance of a supernova at, say, 13.6bn light years away make astronomers ''extremely'' happy? --[[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.211\|172.70.91.211]] 15:40, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
		+
		+	The shape of the graph is very similar to [[815: Mu]] [[User:Firestar233\|guess who]] ([[User talk:Firestar233\|if you want to]] \| [[Special:Contributions/Firestar233\|what i have done]]) 17:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:40, 9 January 2024
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	Anyone know of a recent event that could have inspired this comic? Betelgeuse is mentioned in the explanation but has there been any newsworthy supernovae in the past week? [[User:Alcatraz ii\|Alcatraz ii]] ([[User talk:Alcatraz ii\|talk]]) 05:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		Anyone know of a recent event that could have inspired this comic? Betelgeuse is mentioned in the explanation but has there been any newsworthy supernovae in the past week? [[User:Alcatraz ii\|Alcatraz ii]] ([[User talk:Alcatraz ii\|talk]]) 05:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
	:[https://news.fnal.gov/2024/01/final-supernova-results-from-dark-energy-survey-offer-unique-insights-into-the-expansion-of-the-universe/ Maybe this?] [[Special:Contributions/172.70.210.40\|172.70.210.40]] 12:31, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		:[https://news.fnal.gov/2024/01/final-supernova-results-from-dark-energy-survey-offer-unique-insights-into-the-expansion-of-the-universe/ Maybe this?] [[Special:Contributions/172.70.210.40\|172.70.210.40]] 12:31, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
		+
		+	isn't the chart missing an uptick to the right? wouldn't the appearance of a supernova at, say, 13.6bn light years away make astronomers ''extremely'' happy? --[[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.211\|172.70.91.211]] 15:40, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:31, 9 January 2024
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	Anyone know of a recent event that could have inspired this comic? Betelgeuse is mentioned in the explanation but has there been any newsworthy supernovae in the past week? [[User:Alcatraz ii\|Alcatraz ii]] ([[User talk:Alcatraz ii\|talk]]) 05:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		Anyone know of a recent event that could have inspired this comic? Betelgeuse is mentioned in the explanation but has there been any newsworthy supernovae in the past week? [[User:Alcatraz ii\|Alcatraz ii]] ([[User talk:Alcatraz ii\|talk]]) 05:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)
		+	:[https://news.fnal.gov/2024/01/final-supernova-results-from-dark-energy-survey-offer-unique-insights-into-the-expansion-of-the-universe/ Maybe this?] [[Special:Contributions/172.70.210.40\|172.70.210.40]] 12:31, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:33, 9 January 2024
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	Why the fuck aren’t the units and magnitude of the axes labled? I had to use my brain. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.207.89\|172.70.207.89]] 05:28, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		Why the fuck aren’t the units and magnitude of the axes labled? I had to use my brain. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.207.89\|172.70.207.89]] 05:28, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

		+	Surely there should be some dotted sections, particularly the gap between the edge of the Milky Way and Andromeda, then the next nearest galaxy (where there are few stars)? [[User:RIIW - Ponder it\|RIIW - Ponder it]] ([[User talk:RIIW - Ponder it\|talk]]) 08:33, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

	Anyone know of a recent event that could have inspired this comic? Betelgeuse is mentioned in the explanation but has there been any newsworthy supernovae in the past week? [[User:Alcatraz ii\|Alcatraz ii]] ([[User talk:Alcatraz ii\|talk]]) 05:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)		Anyone know of a recent event that could have inspired this comic? Betelgeuse is mentioned in the explanation but has there been any newsworthy supernovae in the past week? [[User:Alcatraz ii\|Alcatraz ii]] ([[User talk:Alcatraz ii\|talk]]) 05:49, 9 January 2024 (UTC)