Talk:3091: Renormalization - Revision history

162.158.74.69 at 00:20, 22 May 2025

2025-05-22T00:20:33Z

172.68.55.80 at 22:46, 21 May 2025

2025-05-21T22:46:09Z

172.68.205.212 at 22:27, 21 May 2025

2025-05-21T22:27:08Z

Dextrous Fred: Adding my two cents

2025-05-21T17:21:20Z

Adding my two cents

172.71.151.56 at 20:33, 20 May 2025

2025-05-20T20:33:42Z

172.69.224.200 at 15:51, 20 May 2025

2025-05-20T15:51:11Z

172.68.229.46 at 08:49, 20 May 2025

2025-05-20T08:49:26Z

172.69.68.121: Added question

2025-05-20T07:59:36Z

Added question

162.158.42.88 at 04:50, 20 May 2025

2025-05-20T04:50:51Z

162.158.62.106 at 03:52, 20 May 2025

2025-05-20T03:52:27Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:20, 22 May 2025
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	:I might have a degree in physics, but our education on quantum stuff was very weak. My vague impression of renormalization was that equations explain behavior by assuming that for a given particle (like an electron) various virtual particles exist in superposition but many of their interactions cancel out. As someone above said, the particle is thus "interacting with itself" a nigh-infinite number of (theoretical) times. If this simpler conception of renormalization is what Randall is going for, I think the current explanation may be reaching for a more technical (but esoteric) form of the joke. {{unsigned\|Dextrous Fred\|17:21, 21 May 2025}}		:I might have a degree in physics, but our education on quantum stuff was very weak. My vague impression of renormalization was that equations explain behavior by assuming that for a given particle (like an electron) various virtual particles exist in superposition but many of their interactions cancel out. As someone above said, the particle is thus "interacting with itself" a nigh-infinite number of (theoretical) times. If this simpler conception of renormalization is what Randall is going for, I think the current explanation may be reaching for a more technical (but esoteric) form of the joke. {{unsigned\|Dextrous Fred\|17:21, 21 May 2025}}

−	Link for what “stop hitting yourself” looks like: https://youtu.be/GmlV5DDZraA?si=bo_pITBj0WqECQFm (also this is my first contribution so I’m probably doing something wrong but I try!	+	Link for what “stop hitting yourself” looks like: https://youtu.be/GmlV5DDZraA?si=bo_pITBj0WqECQFm (also this is my first contribution so I’m probably doing something wrong but I try! {{unsigned ip\|172.68.55.80\|22:46, 21 May 2025<!-- I could also reply, but this tag tells them what I think they did wrong. There are also several ways to present a link, but that's one of them so it'll do ok as it is... Comparatively so.-->}}

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:46, 21 May 2025
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	:I might have a degree in physics, but our education on quantum stuff was very weak. My vague impression of renormalization was that equations explain behavior by assuming that for a given particle (like an electron) various virtual particles exist in superposition but many of their interactions cancel out. As someone above said, the particle is thus "interacting with itself" a nigh-infinite number of (theoretical) times. If this simpler conception of renormalization is what Randall is going for, I think the current explanation may be reaching for a more technical (but esoteric) form of the joke. {{unsigned\|Dextrous Fred\|17:21, 21 May 2025}}		:I might have a degree in physics, but our education on quantum stuff was very weak. My vague impression of renormalization was that equations explain behavior by assuming that for a given particle (like an electron) various virtual particles exist in superposition but many of their interactions cancel out. As someone above said, the particle is thus "interacting with itself" a nigh-infinite number of (theoretical) times. If this simpler conception of renormalization is what Randall is going for, I think the current explanation may be reaching for a more technical (but esoteric) form of the joke. {{unsigned\|Dextrous Fred\|17:21, 21 May 2025}}
		+
		+	Link for what “stop hitting yourself” looks like: https://youtu.be/GmlV5DDZraA?si=bo_pITBj0WqECQFm (also this is my first contribution so I’m probably doing something wrong but I try!

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:27, 21 May 2025
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	From what I, who does not have a physics degree, can tell, renormalization lets you avoid certain infinite sums or products or something that come up when doing calculations with certain interactions between particles. Based on the comic, I infer that at least one situation that produces an infinite series is the interaction of an electron with itself. So renormalization lets you take the sum of all self-interactions of an electron and turn it into a constant, or discard it entirely, or something like that? Can someone smarter than me tell me if I'm getting this right? [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.56\|172.71.151.56]] 20:33, 20 May 2025 (UTC)		From what I, who does not have a physics degree, can tell, renormalization lets you avoid certain infinite sums or products or something that come up when doing calculations with certain interactions between particles. Based on the comic, I infer that at least one situation that produces an infinite series is the interaction of an electron with itself. So renormalization lets you take the sum of all self-interactions of an electron and turn it into a constant, or discard it entirely, or something like that? Can someone smarter than me tell me if I'm getting this right? [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.56\|172.71.151.56]] 20:33, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

−	:I might have a degree in physics, but our education on quantum stuff was very weak. My vague impression of renormalization was that equations explain behavior by assuming that for a given particle (like an electron) various virtual particles exist in superposition but many of their interactions cancel out. As someone above said, the particle is thus "interacting with itself" a nigh-infinite number of (theoretical) times. If this simpler conception of renormalization is what Randall is going for, I think the current explanation may be reaching for a more technical (but esoteric) form of the joke.	+	:I might have a degree in physics, but our education on quantum stuff was very weak. My vague impression of renormalization was that equations explain behavior by assuming that for a given particle (like an electron) various virtual particles exist in superposition but many of their interactions cancel out. As someone above said, the particle is thus "interacting with itself" a nigh-infinite number of (theoretical) times. If this simpler conception of renormalization is what Randall is going for, I think the current explanation may be reaching for a more technical (but esoteric) form of the joke. {{unsigned\|Dextrous Fred\|17:21, 21 May 2025}}

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:21, 21 May 2025
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	From what I, who does not have a physics degree, can tell, renormalization lets you avoid certain infinite sums or products or something that come up when doing calculations with certain interactions between particles. Based on the comic, I infer that at least one situation that produces an infinite series is the interaction of an electron with itself. So renormalization lets you take the sum of all self-interactions of an electron and turn it into a constant, or discard it entirely, or something like that? Can someone smarter than me tell me if I'm getting this right? [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.56\|172.71.151.56]] 20:33, 20 May 2025 (UTC)		From what I, who does not have a physics degree, can tell, renormalization lets you avoid certain infinite sums or products or something that come up when doing calculations with certain interactions between particles. Based on the comic, I infer that at least one situation that produces an infinite series is the interaction of an electron with itself. So renormalization lets you take the sum of all self-interactions of an electron and turn it into a constant, or discard it entirely, or something like that? Can someone smarter than me tell me if I'm getting this right? [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.56\|172.71.151.56]] 20:33, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+	:I might have a degree in physics, but our education on quantum stuff was very weak. My vague impression of renormalization was that equations explain behavior by assuming that for a given particle (like an electron) various virtual particles exist in superposition but many of their interactions cancel out. As someone above said, the particle is thus "interacting with itself" a nigh-infinite number of (theoretical) times. If this simpler conception of renormalization is what Randall is going for, I think the current explanation may be reaching for a more technical (but esoteric) form of the joke.

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:33, 20 May 2025
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	:It's a performative thing, probably done more to impress the bully's hanger-ons (and/or further embarass the target in front of any other onlookers, especially the girl that the bully thinks it'll impress/dissuade from associating with the target). They may even be some troll logic involved, in that they can ''try'' to claim "they never hit 'em", should authority figures get involved (even be witness to it), though with variable chances of how well that denial is accepted.		:It's a performative thing, probably done more to impress the bully's hanger-ons (and/or further embarass the target in front of any other onlookers, especially the girl that the bully thinks it'll impress/dissuade from associating with the target). They may even be some troll logic involved, in that they can ''try'' to claim "they never hit 'em", should authority figures get involved (even be witness to it), though with variable chances of how well that denial is accepted.
	:Not that I've ever seen (or experienced or, of course, enacted) it IRL, but I'm sure I've seen the likes in many on-screen situations, at least 'of an era'. If there isn't a TVTropes page, for otz then I'd be surprised, but I'm not going down ''that'' rabbit hole just now, so here's just my own understanding. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.224.200\|172.69.224.200]] 15:51, 20 May 2025 (UTC)		:Not that I've ever seen (or experienced or, of course, enacted) it IRL, but I'm sure I've seen the likes in many on-screen situations, at least 'of an era'. If there isn't a TVTropes page, for otz then I'd be surprised, but I'm not going down ''that'' rabbit hole just now, so here's just my own understanding. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.224.200\|172.69.224.200]] 15:51, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+	From what I, who does not have a physics degree, can tell, renormalization lets you avoid certain infinite sums or products or something that come up when doing calculations with certain interactions between particles. Based on the comic, I infer that at least one situation that produces an infinite series is the interaction of an electron with itself. So renormalization lets you take the sum of all self-interactions of an electron and turn it into a constant, or discard it entirely, or something like that? Can someone smarter than me tell me if I'm getting this right? [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.56\|172.71.151.56]] 20:33, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:51, 20 May 2025
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	I'm confused about how the joke works with bullying. My best guess: he's hitting the electron whilst telling it to stop hitting itself, so the incongruity becomes cruelty. Is this a common tactic for bullies? [[Special:Contributions/172.69.68.121\|172.69.68.121]] 07:59, 20 May 2025 (UTC)		I'm confused about how the joke works with bullying. My best guess: he's hitting the electron whilst telling it to stop hitting itself, so the incongruity becomes cruelty. Is this a common tactic for bullies? [[Special:Contributions/172.69.68.121\|172.69.68.121]] 07:59, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
		+	:Not sure how common, but it's a trope, pretty much a staple "jocks vs. nerd" establishing scene in any 'high school' setting in film or TV, at times.
		+	:The idea is that the strong and imposing bully grabs the weak and meek bullied's wrist(s) (perhaps even to prevent blows, albeit mostly just annoying and ineffectual, from the victim) and then uses their superior strength to wrest the target's arms so as to strike themselves, accompanied by taunts such as "why are you hitting yourself..? You shouldn't be hitting yourself...", punctuated by the enforced 'self hits'. More towards the "play-tap" range of actual strength, either for practical reasons (they're more like "one-inch punches" than what they'd inflict, directly in a 'proper fight', and the recipient isn't going to try to help any hit from their own hand) or because its intended more as humiliation than actual intent to physically cause great pain (though lesser pain would be part of the 'game').
		+	:It's a performative thing, probably done more to impress the bully's hanger-ons (and/or further embarass the target in front of any other onlookers, especially the girl that the bully thinks it'll impress/dissuade from associating with the target). They may even be some troll logic involved, in that they can ''try'' to claim "they never hit 'em", should authority figures get involved (even be witness to it), though with variable chances of how well that denial is accepted.
		+	:Not that I've ever seen (or experienced or, of course, enacted) it IRL, but I'm sure I've seen the likes in many on-screen situations, at least 'of an era'. If there isn't a TVTropes page, for otz then I'd be surprised, but I'm not going down ''that'' rabbit hole just now, so here's just my own understanding. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.224.200\|172.69.224.200]] 15:51, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

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 Can someone who understands renormalisation better than I add the bit about self-interaction to the explanation? I did not get that at ALL from the linked Wikipedia page (although I did get the Endless Mike reduction joke from it. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.62.106|162.158.62.106]] 03:52, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
 :I feel you. It seems like the ''site itself'' feels you, the topic is so heavy (maybe it will let me in this time). FWIW, my digging around led me [https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/StopHittingYourself here] and, especially, [https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2011-01-07 here]. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.42.88|162.158.42.88]] 04:50, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
 I'm confused about how the joke works with bullying. My best guess: he's hitting the electron whilst telling it to stop hitting itself, so the incongruity becomes cruelty. Is this a common tactic for bullies? [[Special:Contributions/172.69.68.121|172.69.68.121]] 07:59, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:59, 20 May 2025
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	Can someone who understands renormalisation better than I add the bit about self-interaction to the explanation? I did not get that at ALL from the linked Wikipedia page (although I did get the Endless Mike reduction joke from it. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.62.106\|162.158.62.106]] 03:52, 20 May 2025 (UTC)		Can someone who understands renormalisation better than I add the bit about self-interaction to the explanation? I did not get that at ALL from the linked Wikipedia page (although I did get the Endless Mike reduction joke from it. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.62.106\|162.158.62.106]] 03:52, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
	:I feel you. It seems like the ''site itself'' feels you, the topic is so heavy (maybe it will let me in this time). FWIW, my digging around led me [https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/StopHittingYourself here] and, especially, [https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2011-01-07 here]. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.42.88\|162.158.42.88]] 04:50, 20 May 2025 (UTC)		:I feel you. It seems like the ''site itself'' feels you, the topic is so heavy (maybe it will let me in this time). FWIW, my digging around led me [https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/StopHittingYourself here] and, especially, [https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2011-01-07 here]. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.42.88\|162.158.42.88]] 04:50, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+
		+	I'm confused about how the joke works with bullying. My best guess: he's hitting the electron whilst telling it to stop hitting itself, so the incongruity becomes cruelty. Is this a common tactic for bullies? [[Special:Contributions/172.69.68.121\|172.69.68.121]] 07:59, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:50, 20 May 2025
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	Can someone who understands renormalisation better than I add the bit about self-interaction to the explanation? I did not get that at ALL from the linked Wikipedia page (although I did get the Endless Mike reduction joke from it. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.62.106\|162.158.62.106]] 03:52, 20 May 2025 (UTC)		Can someone who understands renormalisation better than I add the bit about self-interaction to the explanation? I did not get that at ALL from the linked Wikipedia page (although I did get the Endless Mike reduction joke from it. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.62.106\|162.158.62.106]] 03:52, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
		+	:I feel you. It seems like the ''site itself'' feels you, the topic is so heavy (maybe it will let me in this time). FWIW, my digging around led me [https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/StopHittingYourself here] and, especially, [https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2011-01-07 here]. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.42.88\|162.158.42.88]] 04:50, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:52, 20 May 2025
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	Wait, I was dumb. Renormalisation is a self interaction, the interpretation in terms of virtual particles is irrelevant. I was over thinking it. Interacting with itself => hitting itself, simple. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.58.150\|172.70.58.150]] 22:59, 19 May 2025 (UTC)		Wait, I was dumb. Renormalisation is a self interaction, the interpretation in terms of virtual particles is irrelevant. I was over thinking it. Interacting with itself => hitting itself, simple. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.58.150\|172.70.58.150]] 22:59, 19 May 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+	Can someone who understands renormalisation better than I add the bit about self-interaction to the explanation? I did not get that at ALL from the linked Wikipedia page (although I did get the Endless Mike reduction joke from it. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.62.106\|162.158.62.106]] 03:52, 20 May 2025 (UTC)