Difference between revisions of "2408: Egg Strategies"

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(Eggsplanation)
(The explanation for "Chaotic Good" missed an important bit of symmetry, namely that the eggs and non-eggs are distributed in a way that ensures reflective symmetry about a vertical line.)
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|Eggs are picked randomly, while preserving reflective symmetry between eggs and non-eggs.
|Randomly choosing eggs keeps them roughly equally distributed across the carton, while also being chaotic.
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|Randomly choosing eggs keeps them roughly equally distributed across the carton, while also being chaotic. If an egg is removed from one side, its reflection (about the central vertical line of the carton) must remain in place for the sake of balance.
 
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'''Top Right - Chaotic Good'''
 
'''Top Right - Chaotic Good'''
  
[6 eggs spread randomly]
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[6 eggs spread randomly, while preserving reflective symmetry between eggs and non-eggs]
  
  

Revision as of 17:47, 7 January 2021

Egg Strategies
Neutral Evil is for people who like keeping the weight nicely centered in the carton, but also hate everyone else who wants that.
Title text: Neutral Evil is for people who like keeping the weight nicely centered in the carton, but also hate everyone else who wants that.

Eggsplanation

Ambox notice.png This explanation may be incomplete or incorrect: Created by an EGG LISTENING ANXIOUSLY TO THE RADIO. Please mention here why this eggsplanation isn't complete. Do NOT delete this tag too soon.
If you can address this issue, please edit the page! Thanks.

This comic shows nine egg cartons, each of which contains between five and eight eggs. The cartons are presented in the format of a Dungeons & Dragons alignment chart. Originally created as a way of categorizing game characters' motivations, the chart has three possibilities on each axis: lawful/neutral/chaotic on the X axis and good/neutral/evil on the Y axis. Used outside its original purpose, the chart has become a meme used for categorizing things it has no real applicability to. This comic is such a meme. The rationale for deciding how good or evil is based on the TitleText which links how they are balanced in the carton.

A standard egg carton has 12 cups for 12 eggs, but the egg owner is unlikely to consume all 12 eggs at once (unless feeding a great many people, or perhaps making a traditional pound cake). Because of that, the carton will be emptied gradually according to the owners' preference. This comic depicts various possible storage schemes for the unused eggs and assigns them D&D alignments. The final carton, "chaotic evil," shows what appears to be six eggs (counting the yolks) smashed inside the carton.


The center of gravity of the different arrangements shifts as well, contributing to the "goodness" and "lawfulness" of the solutions.

Alignment Description Explanation
Lawful Good Eggs are picked from the edges, with the eggs in the center remaining Taking eggs away from the edges of the carton first keeps the center of gravity of the carton in the middle. It also minimizes the moment of inertia, making it easy to rotate the carton to change its orientation. According to Randall, this is considered good.
Neutral Good Eggs are picked from the center of the carton, leaving the eggs on the edges. This leaves the center of gravity slightly towards the left. While the center of gravity is at the center of the carton when the number of eggs is even, the carton has a relatively high moment of inertia. Randall interprets this as “Neutral Good”
Chaotic Good Eggs are picked randomly, while preserving reflective symmetry between eggs and non-eggs. Randomly choosing eggs keeps them roughly equally distributed across the carton, while also being chaotic. If an egg is removed from one side, its reflection (about the central vertical line of the carton) must remain in place for the sake of balance.
Lawful Neutral Eggs are picked from the top row first, then the bottom, starting on one side. This is a very organised method of picking eggs from a carton, but the center of mass shifts to one side.
True Neutral Eggs are picked from one side, with both rows being roughly equal. The geometry of egg carton allows for easy inserting in the refrigerator shelf. If the carton is inserted with the remaining eggs facing outwards, then the center of the mass is where you would typically grab the carton which allows for very good handling and small chance of accident. Some people consider this method to be optimal [source missing]. However if the carton is inserted with empty space facing outwards – then this is a disaster waiting to happen.
Chaotic Neutral Eggs are picked in a chessboard pattern. The center of mass is kept central, but this is a very unusual way of picking eggs from a carton.
Lawful Evil Eggs are kept in the middle of the carton, stacked atop each other in a pyramid shape. This keeps the weight nicely centered, but makes it impossible to close the lid of the carton.
Neutral Evil Eggs are stacked in the exact middle of the open carton, in the top row and on the open lid. This keeps the weight centered in the carton only when the lid is open. Since the lid is not rigid, someone picking up the carton would have to hold the lid and carton separately so that the eggs don't fall off.
Chaotic Evil Eggs are smashed in the center of the carton. The weight is centered but the eggs are broken. They cannot be easily transferred from the carton, and will likely spoil quickly.


An alignment chart was also featured in 2251: Alignment Chart Alignment Chart, which was published exactly one year earlier.

Transcript

Ambox notice.png This transcript is incomplete. Please help editing it! Thanks.

[3x3 grid of egg cartons, each containing between 5-8 eggs in an arrangement matching a description of lawful/neutral/chaotic paired with good/neutral/evil]

[each egg carton is depicted from a top-down view, with the lid open and the eggs and their places visible]


Top Left - Lawful Good

[6 eggs centered

3 in the top row, shifted to the right

3 in the bottom row, shifted to the left]


Top Center - Neutral Good

[7 eggs

4 in the left side

3 in the right side, with one in the top row and two in the bottom row]


Top Right - Chaotic Good

[6 eggs spread randomly, while preserving reflective symmetry between eggs and non-eggs]


Middle Left - Lawful Neutral

[5 eggs all on the bottom row, starting on the left side]


Middle Center - True Neutral

[7 eggs all to the left side

4 in the top row

3 in the bottom row]


Middle Right - Chaotic Neutral

[6 eggs staggered in every other space so that each egg is diagonal from the two nearest

no two eggs are directly next to each other side-to-side or up-and-down

3 in the top row, starting in the left most position

3 in the bottom row; starting position second from the left side]


Bottom Left - Lawful Evil

[8 eggs

6 in the egg carton, centered but offset one place to the left; 3 eggs each on the top and bottom

2 eggs are on top of the 6 that are placed in the carton]


Bottom Center - Neutral Evil

[8 eggs

3 on the bottom edge of the lid

2 in the top center positions in the egg carton

3 centered on the edge and on top of/between the eggs on the lid and the eggs in the proper positions]


Bottom Right - Chaotic Evil

[broken eggs in the center of the carton and spilling/splattering over the rest of the carton and onto the lid

6 or 7 yellow-orange yolks are visible

the spilled egg whites are colored light yellow-greenish

several pieces of egg shells, varying in size from approximately one-half to very small chips are mixed in with the yolks and whites]


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Discussion

I'm not going to get into it because it's not related to these egg cartons, but it is really weird sitting here explaining a joke while I listen to breaking news on the radio. Captain Video (talk) 22:24, 6 January 2021 (UTC)

Why are you lot all anxiously listening to the radio? Is there something I should know? 162.158.7.15 21:39, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
Perhaps this, or this? Nk1406 (talk) 01:34, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
Why is the news breaking? Does a Chaotic Evil person maintain the news carton? 162.158.2.210 09:34, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

I really thought it was just me who cared about center of gravity for eggs. 162.158.79.49 23:43, 6 January 2021 (UTC)

We keep the hard boiled ones at one end and the fr4esh ones at the other end.

Bring True Neutral (egg carton sits lengthwise in fridge, most convenient egg is removed until carton is empty), I am baffled by the existence of other "strategies". Do people really do this? 108.162.241.70 00:57, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

True Neutral here, and also putting the carton in the fridge eggless side out (which is consistent with "most convenient egg removed"). The current explanation says that this is "a disaster waiting to happen". Why?
As a side-note, as I understand it, the alternate strategies can be convenient if you don't put the carton lengthwise in the fridge (particularly if you don't put it in the fridge at all). 162.158.183.117 11:26, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
I am also True Neutral - when putting the carton into the fridge end-first it allows me to extract it with the majority of the weight in my hand. It's a disaster if it is inserted the heavy side in first because when I grab the empty end the weight of the eggs can tip them out the other side. As an aside, I was a little insulted to find out that I am not the only person in the world who actually has an "egg carton strategy". I thought I was unique! ;-) Rtanenbaum (talk) 13:40, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
Ha, no, far from it! Nothing new under the sun, I guess. Here's some documentation of prior art by John McIntosh from 2006, under the title "Egg Carton Theory". Dvgrn (talk) 17:27, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
Chiming in on True Neutral strategy, which I also use, with some added thoughts: I also put the heavy end in first, but primarily because I usually have two cartons stacked, where inserting the heavy end on top of the full carton in the fridge makes it easier to push the carton the rest of the way in on top of the bottom carton. Putting it in the other way around, the heavy end is hanging off the bottom carton, resulting in less stability before it's pushed all the way in. If you can't tell, I'm an engineer! Ianrbibtitlht (talk) 14:41, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
Chaotic Neutral here. Doing it that way means I have the benefit of a seemingly random egg without thinking too much about which egg to actually pick. 108.162.229.220 17:35, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
Being Lawful Good and married to someone who is Chaotic Good, we might sometimes argue over this. 162.158.62.29 03:23, 7 January 2021 (UTC) MSS
I guess my strategy is True Neutral as well, though my reason being that I put the empty side face the back of the freezer to reduce the chance of frost, which I assumed is bad for eggs. Tharkon (talk) 20:13, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

Ignoring the "neutral" part for now, what's chaotic about that? It's literally the most perfectly balanced arrangement. It has perfect rotational symmetry as well. 162.158.74.219 04:01, 8 January 2021 (UTC)

Carton size

In Germany, there are two sizes of egg cartons, containing 6 or 10 eggs, respectively. Most refrigerators I’ve seen (in stores or households) contain an egg-holder with six dents, though I also have occasionally seen 10-dent egg holders. Since I usually buy 20 eggs at the weekly market, my strategy is to transfer the eggs from a package to the egg holder once there are less than 9 left in the package (for the purpose of knowing how many are still left without having to open a package). If there are more than six eggs, the one or two additional eggs are placed lying besides the egg holder. I think that counts as chaotic neutral. 141.101.68.28 01:42, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

I've only seen cartons of six or ten as well, the phrase "A standard egg carton has 12 cups for 12 eggs" seems a bit presumptuous. Tharkon (talk) 20:13, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
I'm usually using cartons of six, however I noticed I have few cartons of ten left here. Regardless, I feel like it SHOULD be dozen eggs ... not sure why, maybe it used to be dozen (12) in past? -- Hkmaly (talk) 04:38, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
Just to add some info on egg carton sizes: here in the Netherlands, most cartons contain 6 eggs, although there are cartons with 3, 4, 7 and 10 eggs as well. The carton with 7 eggs has one egg in the middle, so any strategy would take the middle egg either first or last (anything else seems insane). Having seen American fridges in TV shows, I guess the larger egg cartons in the USA have something to do with their larger fridges (or perhaps it's the other way round).162.158.159.108 16:17, 8 January 2021 (UTC)

Depiction wrong

I've got a niggling feeling that Chaotic Neutral (at least) is wrongly depicted. Too orderly. I'd have put Chaotic Good's pattern there (not necessarily vice-versa, as the current incumbent looks more Lawful or Variation-of-neutrality as well as Good) as attempting to maintain balance but with an element of chance. We don't know what sequence of removal led to each of these states, of course. That might make much of the difference in how we reach the illustrated states. 162.158.158.253 03:03, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

I'd go a little further and swap CG and CN (the current CG being a marginally more ordered and balanced CN) but otherwise agree. CN is the strategy I use when the carton is at risk of being centrally supported while in humid conditions (don't ask), making NG risk bending of the whole carton. LG is actually worse then NG in some circumstances, due to a drastically reduced moment of inertia contributing to the chance of dropping. On the other hand, NG increases the probability of end-shattering if the carton is actually dropped. Overall, different strategies are probably a result of experience, circumstance, relative clumsiness, and hat colour. 162.158.166.75 05:43, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

I feel like the chaotic good isn't random. It seems like it could be Braille or something like that, maybe? I don't know, I might looking for patterns where there are none.

Is it bother anyone that there are different numbers of eggs in each carton? At least there should have been two boxes for each alignment, one with an even number of eggs and one with odd.

I was thinking precisely this. Can lead to a sense of "apples and oranges" otherwise. 108.162.216.49 15:51, 7 January 2021 (UTC)MeZimm


Refrigeration

Learned something today: Americans refrigerate eggs 162.158.155.84 18:55, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

It has something to do with the way that they're treated over here. We don't (have to) refrigerate fresh eggs. -neverdroptop 19:56, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
I refrigerate eggs as well, and I'm not American.Tharkon (talk) 20:13, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
If eggs are washed with a bleach solution prior to packaging, their membranous outer coating (often including quite bit of blood &\or feces) gets stripped away, leaving the shell's surface porous & receptive to contaminants; thereafter those eggs can become spoiled much more readily. In the US, all eggs shipped across state lines for sale as food must be rinsed, therefore almost all eggs shipped to any US supermarket grocery, need to be refrigerated. If you get fresh eggs unrinsed, they can sit unrefrigerated for weeks without a significant rate of spoilage. ProphetZarquon (talk) 20:45, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

Alternative strategies

My egg strategy was “you can’t possibly be 🏳️‍⚧️ this is just some fetish” at which point I got super comfortable liking all the girly things ever because it didn’t mean 🏳️‍⚧️. Then when I finally realized I was the last to know.