Editing 24: Godel, Escher, Kurt Halsey

{{comic
| number    = 24
| date      = September 30, 2005
| title     = Godel, Escher, Kurt Halsey
| image     = godel_escher_kurthalsey.jpg
| imagesize = 
| titletext = I love the idea here, though of course it's not a great-quality drawing or scan.
}}

==Explanation==
The name of the comic is a take on the book {{w|Gödel, Escher, Bach}}.  The book is about "strange loops", self-reference, and recurring patterns, partially shown through the works of the three people in its title.

{{w|Kurt Gödel}} was a 20th century mathematician most famous for mathematically proving that there are some mathematical truths that can't be proven.

{{w|M. C. Escher}} was a 20th century artist most famous for mathematically-inspired engravings of tessellated animals, impossible scenes, distorted images that contained themselves, and so on.

{{w|Johann Sebastian Bach}} was a German composer and musician during the Baroque Period

[http://www.kurthalsey.com Kurt Halsey] is a comic artist from Oregon.

==Transcript==
:Drawn during an unending NASA lecture.
:[Two people are talking, one in a hat.]
:Hatless: it's just so hard to compare kids now with kids in the past. you can't help but to belong to one group or the other.

:Hatless: and of course every generation seems awful to the one before it. look at quotes from throughout history.

:Hatted: yeah, and it sure would be nice to have some perspective on some of this stuff. I just don't know what to make of it.
:[Circles are appearing--maybe snow?]

:Hatless: i guess you do what you can to help the people around you and hope it turns out okay.

:Hatless: in the end, what else can you do?

:Hatted: lead a crusade?

:[We can no longer see the people, just the circles.]
:it's presentism, man. the idea that historical context is irrelevant, that we understand it

:all that we need take no warnings from the follies of the past. that we're facing something new.

:socrates couldn't imagine the internet. but people don't change.
:[We can start to see the corner of a darker circle in the lower right.]

:(The borders between the three panels on this line are cracking.)
:have you seen those collections of historical pornography? talk about historical context.

:did you know the first porn photo was bestial in.
:[inside a circle:] nature?

:at least that stuff was out of the mainstream
:[each word in one circle:]
:no
:just
:in
:history

:(the three panels have merged into one on each row.)

:i don't know about you, but
:[circled] I
:[uncircled] never

:even once seen

:[The circles are highly variable in size now, and pressed up against a larger one on the right side.]

:[There is mass of circles of different sizes, with some dark fissures in between, against the side of a large circle which we can see part of in the right half of the panel. They look like cells. There's a tiny square in the center of the giant cell.]

:[We see only the tiny square, centered. It has a few marks inside it.]

:[Closer, the square is divided into rectangles of different sizes, each of which has text in it.]

:[Much closer, we can see fragments of the text. Some are sideways, some are cut off, some are too small to read.]
:machine language translated by principles of isomorphism it is a consequence of the Church-Turing thesis that ...
:but how do you select the channel you wish to se-
:thou ... shou ... palin ... stri ... it is a ... crab ...

:[Closer still, we can just see a huge sideways s and h.]

:[Those letters are faded and mixed with a faded version of the next panel.]

:girls take boys away ...
:never be further than a phone call and a goosebumped shiver away ...
:drove all night listening to mix tapes ...
:the past is just practice
:[There is a heart at the bottom and, in the lower left, the name Kurt.]

:[The same as the previous panel, but with the words blurred out to scribbles.]

:[Jagged, shaded shapes and strands start to fall. Faint panel borders appear again. There is a person on the far right.]

:(Back to three panels per row.)
:[A man and woman are standing amid the fragments.]

:Man: There's too much. And so little feels important.

:[The jagged edge of the shaded area is encroaching on the sides of the panel.]

:What do you do?

:[We see them from farther away through a rough hole in the shaded area. Bits continue to fall around them.]

:[She takes his hand.]

==Trivia==
* Original [[Randall]] quote: "One of a series of strips I drew during a long and boring NASA lecture. It careers wildly from intellectual to chaotic to Godel, Escher, Bach to Kurt Halsey to chaotic and sappy."
* The original comment on LiveJournal suggests that the actual image there was only part of this strip (and that the above is the whole series). Unfortunately, the image link in live journal is broken.
* Original title "Strip series"
* This is the sixth comic posted to livejournal.  The previous comic was [[1: Barrel - Part 1]], the next is [[13: Canyon]].

{{comic discussion}}
[[Category:Comics posted on livejournal]]
[[Category:Comics featuring Cueball]]
[[Category:Comics featuring Megan]]
@@ Line 3: / Line 3: @@
 | date      = September 30, 2005
 | title     = Godel, Escher, Kurt Halsey
-| before    = <big><big><span class="plainlinks">[https://web.archive.org/web/20070927001941/http://xkcd-drawings.livejournal.com/?skip=40#:~:text=8%3A40%20pm-,Strip%20series,-One%20of%20a Original title</span>]: '''Strip series'''</big></big><br><br>[[#Explanation|↓ Skip to explanation ↓]]
 | image     = godel_escher_kurthalsey.jpg
-| titletext = I love the idea here, though of course it's not a great-quality drawing or scan.<br><br><span class="plainlinks">[https://web.archive.org/web/20070927001941/http://xkcd-drawings.livejournal.com/?skip=40#:~:text=8%3A40%20pm-,Strip%20series,-One%20of%20a Original caption</span>]: One of a series of strips I drew during a long and boring NASA lecture. It careers wildly from intellectual to chaotic to Godel, Escher, Bach to Kurt Halsey to chaotic and sappy.<br>The whole series is [http://www.xkcd.com/comic/comic.html here].
+| imagesize =
+| titletext = I love the idea here, though of course it's not a great-quality drawing or scan.
 }}
 ==Explanation==
-This was the sixth comic originally posted to [[LiveJournal]]. The previous one was [[1: Barrel - Part 1]], and the next one was [[13: Canyon]]. It was among the [[:Category:First day on LiveJournal|first thirteen comics]] posted to LiveJournal within 12 minutes on September 30, 2005, on the first day of the xkcd LiveJournal account.
+The name of the comic is a take on the book {{w|Gödel, Escher, Bach}}.  The book is about "strange loops", self-reference, and recurring patterns, partially shown through the works of the three people in its title.
-At the time [[xkcd]] was created, [[Randall]] was working on robotics at {{w|NASA}}'s Langley Center. This comic was drawn during that period, while attending a talk that he didn't seem to like. The comic is drawn in the form of a {{w|storyboard}} and is intended to be visualized as an animated sequence. In the first part of the comic, two people discuss the difficulty of comparing past and present generations, since the person making the comparison invariably belongs to one of the two groups. The character with a hat is not [[Black Hat]], as Randall hadn't standardized his character designs yet. The assembly of text panels found in the middle of the strip is similar to [[124: Blogofractal]]. The philosophy of Kurt Gödel is also a theme in [[468: Fetishes]].
+{{w|Kurt Gödel}} was a 20th century mathematician most famous for mathematically proving that there are some mathematical truths that can't be proven.
-The name of the comic is a portmanteau-like play on the following:
+{{w|M. C. Escher}} was a 20th century artist most famous for mathematically-inspired engravings of tessellated animals, impossible scenes, distorted images that contained themselves, and so on.
-* ''{{w|Gödel, Escher, Bach}}'' is a book by {{w|Douglas Hofstadter}}. He is an American author who has written several books about philosophy, mathematics, and science. This particular book is his most famous one, about "strange loops", self-reference, and recurring patterns, partially shown through the works of the three people in its title:
-** {{w|Kurt Gödel}} was a 20th-century mathematician most famous for proving that in our commonly used axiomatic systems, there are true propositions that cannot be proved from the axioms. His proof used a self-referential paradox.
-** {{w|M. C. Escher}} was a 20th-century artist most famous for mathematically inspired engravings of tessellated animals, impossible scenes, [http://philosopherdeveloper.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/devilsangels.jpg hyperbolic geometry], and so on. The form of this strip resembles one of his [http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/2c/Escher,_Metamorphosis_II.jpg Metamorphosis etchings].
-** {{w|Johann Sebastian Bach}} was a German composer and musician from the {{w|Baroque Period}}, famous for numerous works such as the ''{{w|Brandenburg Concertos}}'' and his extensive use of the fugue form of composition, which involves the expression of a theme, its development, and finally a recapitulation or return to the original expression.
-* Kurt Halsey is a comic artist from {{w|Oregon}}. His work often contains introspective philosophical musings. At least one phrase in the letter is attributed to Halsey, "The past is just practice".
-The original caption contains a [http://www.xkcd.com/comic/comic.html defunct link], which indicates that the comic posted on LiveJournal was only part of this series. Unfortunately, both the image in the LiveJournal post and the link in the caption weren't archived in the Web Archive, so we can't confirm if there is even more to this comic than now available on [https://xkcd.com xkcd.com] or if the original post only covered part of this series. However, based on how Randall describes the "full series" in the caption ("It careers wildly from intellectual to chaotic to Godel, Escher, Bach to Kurt Halsey to chaotic and sappy."), it's more likely that the comic on [https://xkcd.com xkcd.com] is the full series, and the LiveJournal post only included the initial part, possibly to occupy less space in the feed. All the adjectives used in the caption perfectly match the flow of the comic.
+{{w|Johann Sebastian Bach}} was a German composer and musician during the Baroque Period
-===Interpretations===
+[http://www.kurthalsey.com Kurt Halsey] is a comic artist from Oregon.
-* The bubbles may illustrate ideas, memories, or subjects that one could wonder about. In the context of the boring talk, this would mean that Randall is lost in thoughts and gradually loses focus of things going on around him. He sees the talk as mundane, as a part of so many other "subject bubbles". Even the comic vertical lines (and therefore the strip's structure) seem to lose their sense to Randall as they collapse and become part of the scene, eventually merging three panels into one. They later reappear for the last six panels.
-* The big bubble pushing the small ones further outside may demonstrate how shallow the surface bubbles are to him, or represent an infinite (or very large) number of small bubbles.
-* The quote stating "There's too much. And so little feels important." tells us that he feels overwhelmed by the world, maybe by information given in the NASA talk or by events in his life. He recognizes what is important to him, and he feels that it is small compared to the size of the worries of the world (or the big bubble). He may have experienced a sort of existential crisis before turning to his feeling of love in the last panels, when asking himself, "What do you do?".
-* The structure of the strip has some abstract connections with the structure of the book. The beginning, middle, and end sequences reflect back on themselves; the strip displays some symmetry. In the book, there's an interplay of contributions from the artist, the musician, and the mathematician; some of this is present in the strip [Lots of citations missing].
-* The biggest bubble is expanding, and on it is a fractal arrangement of articles describing various scientific and philosophical discussions. A subjective interpretation is that the fractal nature of the excerpts is a comment on the unending attempt to rationalize and justify the unchanging nature of humanity. The largest bubble bursts, leaving the two figures on a shred of what once was. The final question is, "What do you do when the bubble bursts?" It seems that his answer is to find someone and love them; in the end, that's all that matters. The rest is just air.
 ==Transcript==
-:Drawn during an unending NASA lecture
+:Drawn during an unending NASA lecture.
 :[Two people are talking, one in a hat.]
-:Cueball: it's just so hard to compare kids now with kids in the past. you can't help but to belong to one group or the other.
+:Hatless: it's just so hard to compare kids now with kids in the past. you can't help but to belong to one group or the other.
-:Cueball: and of course every generation seems awful to the one before it. look at quotes from throughout history.
+:Hatless: and of course every generation seems awful to the one before it. look at quotes from throughout history.
-:Hatted: yeah, and it sure would be nice to have some historical perspective on some of this stuff. I just don't know what to make of it.
+:Hatted: yeah, and it sure would be nice to have some perspective on some of this stuff. I just don't know what to make of it.
 :[Circles are appearing--maybe snow?]
-:Cueball: i guess you do what you can to help the people around you and hope it turns out okay.
+:Hatless: i guess you do what you can to help the people around you and hope it turns out okay.
-:Cueball: in the end, what else can you do?
+:Hatless: in the end, what else can you do?
 :Hatted: lead a crusade?
@@ Line 51: / Line 41: @@
 :socrates couldn't imagine the internet. but people don't change.
-:[We can start to see a darker circle in the lower right corner.]
+:[We can start to see the corner of a darker circle in the lower right.]
 :(The borders between the three panels on this line are cracking.)
@@ Line 86: / Line 76: @@
 :but how do you select the channel you wish to se-
 :thou ... shou ... palin ... stri ... it is a ... crab ...
-:be obvious to one-s ... your great intellectual achievements ... Tortise. Why ... you give this old Tortise ...
 :[Closer still, we can just see a huge sideways s and h.]
@@ Line 103: / Line 92: @@
 :(Back to three panels per row.)
-:[Cueball and Megan are standing amid the fragments.]
+:[A man and woman are standing amid the fragments.]
-:Cueball: There's too much. And so little feels important.
+:Man: There's too much. And so little feels important.
 :[The jagged edge of the shaded area is encroaching on the sides of the panel.]
@@ Line 113: / Line 102: @@
 :[We see them from farther away through a rough hole in the shaded area. Bits continue to fall around them.]
-:[They are holding hands.]
+:[She takes his hand.]
 ==Trivia==
-This is the first xkcd comic featuring [[stick figure]]s, [[Cueball]], [[Megan]], and [[:Category:Multiple Cueballs|Multiple Cueballs]].
+* Original [[Randall]] quote: "One of a series of strips I drew during a long and boring NASA lecture. It careers wildly from intellectual to chaotic to Godel, Escher, Bach to Kurt Halsey to chaotic and sappy."
+* The original comment on LiveJournal suggests that the actual image there was only part of this strip (and that the above is the whole series). Unfortunately, the image link in live journal is broken.
+* Original title "Strip series"
+* This is the sixth comic posted to livejournal.  The previous comic was [[1: Barrel - Part 1]], the next is [[13: Canyon]].
 {{comic discussion}}
+[[Category:Comics posted on livejournal]]
-[[Category:Posted on LiveJournal| 06]]
-[[Category:First day on LiveJournal| 06]]
-[[Category:First day on xkcd.com]]
-[[Category:Large drawings]]
 [[Category:Comics featuring Cueball]]
 [[Category:Comics featuring Megan]]
-[[Category:Multiple Cueballs]]
-[[Category:Romance]]
-[[Category:Philosophy]]
-[[Category:Comics with lowercase text]]