Editing Talk:2799: Frankenstein Claim Permutations

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Expanding on [[1589: Frankenstein]], clearly. [[User:Trimeta|Trimeta]] ([[User talk:Trimeta|talk]]) 03:17, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

The last permutation is a garden path sentence that starts off talking about the TV show ''Doctor Who''. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.62.175|162.158.62.175]] 03:21, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

:"The [unnamed] ''Doctor Who'' [Dr. Who might be a function title like Q and M in the James Bond Franchises] [whom] creates ''Mary Shelly'' in ''Frankenstein'''s novel". Does this mean Frankenstein is the original creator of the Dr. Who universe? [[User:IIVQ|IIVQ]] ([[User talk:IIVQ|talk]]) 12:49, 8 July 2023 (UTC)


:The title text seems straightforward enough to me, anyways: "No, the doctor (who creates Mary Shelley (in Frankenstein's novel)) doesn't have a name." Not much of a garden path sentence at all. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.34.187|172.70.34.187]] 03:43, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

The best part of this comic is that every last one of these claims is wrong. In the original novel, Victor Frankenstein is an obsessive undergrad, notably with no medical degree. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.35|172.71.151.35]] 03:54, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

You could argue rather that Walton and Saville were the names of the authors. The monster Shelly created was named Victor von Frankenstein. The tragic hero was unnamed. [[User:EebstertheGreat|EebstertheGreat]] ([[User talk:EebstertheGreat|talk]]) 04:02, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

Pretty sure that Randall saw the image of the misprinted book where the title is Mary Shelly, and the author is Frankenstein. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.35|172.71.151.35]] 06:54, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

:See here: https://twitter.com/MedCrisis/status/1511644464544104452?t=B23sq4iftXXWPdSKYCqOyg&s=19
[[User:Svízel přítula|Svízel přítula]] ([[User talk:Svízel přítula|talk]]) 08:46, 8 July 2023 (UTC)
::I doubt that's an actual misprint, probably photoshopped as a joke, which then inspired this comic that explores all the permutations. [[User:Barmar|Barmar]] ([[User talk:Barmar|talk]]) 14:03, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

No, Frankenstein is the name of the novel created by the monster (according to her sleepless readers) Mary Shelley. [[Special:Contributions/172.68.34.38|172.68.34.38]] 08:12, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

The second permutation could be read in the "the scientist who abandoned his creation is the ''real'' monster" sense. --[[Special:Contributions/172.69.62.28|172.69.62.28]] 11:19, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

The Doctor joined the Who and married Shelley, the inventor of Monster energy drinks. [[Special:Contributions/108.162.237.102|108.162.237.102]] 12:28, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

Very funny (I'd like to read that book myself) but ironic to be so aware of this controversy of detail without ever acknowledging that *Frankenstein is actually a student not a doctor.*

Should the title text explanation be after the table? —[[User:Purah126|Purah126]] ([[User talk:Purah126|talk]]) 13:38, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

I think the "I would read this book" permutation is because it's a "meta" novel, and Randall loves meta stuff. [[User:Barmar|Barmar]] ([[User talk:Barmar|talk]]) 14:05, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

I swear, ever since I read [[1589: Frankenstein]] I've WANTED it to come up, to say "THIS is my canon", LOL! It's rather inconvenient that the monster is unnamed, and if he were it wouldn't be the more logical TITULAR name. I mean, at Hallowe'en kids tend to dress as the monster - though I've seen at least one thing (I want to guess Young Sheldon, or perhaps Old Sheldon, i.e. Big Bang Theory) where someone dressed as Victor and was like "I SAID I was dressing as Frankenstein!". :) [[User:NiceGuy1|NiceGuy1]] ([[User talk:NiceGuy1|talk]]) 04:38, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

"Intelligence is knowing that Frankenstein is not the monster. Wisdom is knowing that Frankenstein *is* the monster." Fittingly, History and Investigation are Intelligence-based, while Insight is Wisdon-based. --[[User:Coconut Galaxy|Coconut Galaxy]] ([[User talk:Coconut Galaxy|talk]]) 08:59, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

;Name of the monster
''(cut and pasted from Main page Talk, where it was erroneously added)''

It's worth pointing out, that although the Monster didn't have a name in Mary Shelly's original book, a derivative work did give the monster a name. 

Specifically, Herman.

Further, it's worth pointing out that although the monster was not a begotten son of Dr. Frankenstein, Dr. Frankenstein was the only parent the monster had, so by tradition, his last name would also be Frankenstein.

So the monster's name is, by reason, "Herman Frankenstein"...

at least until he changes his name, such as getting married and taking his spouse's name. {{unsigned ip|172.71.142.29|...02:44, 9 July 2023}}
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 Very funny (I'd like to read that book myself) but ironic to be so aware of this controversy of detail without ever acknowledging that *Frankenstein is actually a student not a doctor.*
-Correct: Victor was not yet a doctor of any sort. Never underestimate the motivated ABD. [[User:MolochHamovis|MolochHamovis]] ([[User talk:MolochHamovis|talk]]) 06:55, 23 July 2023 (UTC)
 Should the title text explanation be after the table? —[[User:Purah126|Purah126]] ([[User talk:Purah126|talk]]) 13:38, 8 July 2023 (UTC)
@@ Line 35: / Line 33: @@
 I swear, ever since I read [[1589: Frankenstein]] I've WANTED it to come up, to say "THIS is my canon", LOL! It's rather inconvenient that the monster is unnamed, and if he were it wouldn't be the more logical TITULAR name. I mean, at Hallowe'en kids tend to dress as the monster - though I've seen at least one thing (I want to guess Young Sheldon, or perhaps Old Sheldon, i.e. Big Bang Theory) where someone dressed as Victor and was like "I SAID I was dressing as Frankenstein!". :) [[User:NiceGuy1|NiceGuy1]] ([[User talk:NiceGuy1|talk]]) 04:38, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
-"Intelligence is knowing that Frankenstein is not the monster. Wisdom is knowing that Frankenstein *is* the monster." Fittingly, History and Investigation are Intelligence-based, while Insight is Wisdom-based. --[[User:Coconut Galaxy|Coconut Galaxy]] ([[User talk:Coconut Galaxy|talk]]) 08:59, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
+"Intelligence is knowing that Frankenstein is not the monster. Wisdom is knowing that Frankenstein *is* the monster." Fittingly, History and Investigation are Intelligence-based, while Insight is Wisdon-based. --[[User:Coconut Galaxy|Coconut Galaxy]] ([[User talk:Coconut Galaxy|talk]]) 08:59, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
-The unanswered question is, who is the victor?[[Special:Contributions/172.70.85.131|172.70.85.131]] 11:27, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
 ;Name of the monster
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 at least until he changes his name, such as getting married and taking his spouse's name. {{unsigned ip|172.71.142.29|...02:44, 9 July 2023}}
-It's a throwaway comment, and one which most readers seem to overlook, but the Creature IS named, exactly ONCE in the book: his name is Adam. It comes up in a conversation where the Creature says (I'm paraphrasing), "You called me Adam, I'd rather be called Satan now." The names are chosen by Shelley quite deliberately - Adam is mythologically the 'first' man, while 'satan' means 'enemy'. It marks the shift in their relationship to the adversarial one which will result in both their deaths. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.79.147|172.69.79.147]] 04:45, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
-:I believe the phrase goes "I ''ought to be'' thy Adam" (my emphasis), and it's in reported speech as conveyed by Victor (as further conveyed by the Captain) so it might even be a matter of Unreliable Narrator(s) being more poetic than accurate, anyway. But the self-claiming in the full phrase is more solidly for that of deciding to take on the name of Satan than for Adam (which is given as a prior option, but maybe one not actually previously adopted). There's no real idea what Victor might have ever dubbed his 'newborn' (if indeed he did have any intent to do so), nor what name the pre-Creature being may have gone by before he became Victor's experiments – which could be considered technically valid, even if his conscious identity was indeed wiped/reset by the death-and-revival(-and-'improvement'?) phase of his existence. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.178.169|172.71.178.169]] 09:42, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
-The oft-forgotten subtitle of the book was ''The Modern Prometheus'', which, being that Prometheus gave fire and Victor gave life, means that the title is clearly about Victor and the "intelligence/wisdom" stuff is just an observation, though not a wrong one. [[User:AndrewXKCD|AndrewXKCD]] ([[User talk:AndrewXKCD|talk]]) 18:43, 12 July 2023 (UTC)
-Two levels of cleverness. Level One—you know that Frankenstein is not the monster. Level Two—you know that, actually, Frankenstein ''is'' the monster.[[Special:Contributions/198.41.238.36|198.41.238.36]] 13:11, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
-Chaos itself: "No one knows the name of the Doctor Mary Shelley, who is the monster that created the author of the novel titled 'Frankenstein'." [[User:Ben|Ben]] ([[User talk:Ben|talk]]) 22:04, 16 August 2023 (UTC)