Editing Talk:1193: Externalities
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: As are [schools].ac.in | : As are [schools].ac.in | ||
: I can't get my university (PUC-Rio, in Brazil) too... =/ [[Special:Contributions/139.82.240.51|139.82.240.51]] 18:28, 1 April 2013 (UTC) etandel | : I can't get my university (PUC-Rio, in Brazil) too... =/ [[Special:Contributions/139.82.240.51|139.82.240.51]] 18:28, 1 April 2013 (UTC) etandel | ||
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--[[Special:Contributions/137.147.40.248|137.147.40.248]] 13:53, 1 April 2013 (UTC) For an easier time spotting the changes, go to [http://xkcd.com/1193/#verbose] and open your web console | --[[Special:Contributions/137.147.40.248|137.147.40.248]] 13:53, 1 April 2013 (UTC) For an easier time spotting the changes, go to [http://xkcd.com/1193/#verbose] and open your web console | ||
− | [[Special:Contributions/199.48.226.89|199.48.226.89]] 10:18, 1 April 2013 (UTC) I put in "caltech.edu" and hashed a lot of words, and "Twilight Sparkle is best pony." was the best result I managed, only off by 496 | + | [[Special:Contributions/199.48.226.89|199.48.226.89]] 10:18, 1 April 2013 (UTC) I put in "caltech.edu" and hashed a lot of words, and "Twilight Sparkle is best pony." was the best result I managed, only off by 496 tits. |
: Lol, "only". The results should be binomially distributed, with a mean of 512, so 496 isn't even close to the scores in the ranking. [[User:BKA|BKA]] ([[User talk:BKA|talk]]) 12:44, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | : Lol, "only". The results should be binomially distributed, with a mean of 512, so 496 isn't even close to the scores in the ranking. [[User:BKA|BKA]] ([[User talk:BKA|talk]]) 12:44, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
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[[Special:Contributions/91.214.44.212|91.214.44.212]] 23:34, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | [[Special:Contributions/91.214.44.212|91.214.44.212]] 23:34, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
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All I see is a blank white 780x969 image. Nothing appears when I hover over stuff. [[Special:Contributions/109.65.100.208|109.65.100.208]] 09:04, 1 April 2013 (UTC) | All I see is a blank white 780x969 image. Nothing appears when I hover over stuff. [[Special:Contributions/109.65.100.208|109.65.100.208]] 09:04, 1 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
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:Looks like one random string and one random pair of strings. [[Special:Contributions/178.238.159.109|178.238.159.109]] 20:12, 1 April 2013 (UTC) | :Looks like one random string and one random pair of strings. [[Special:Contributions/178.238.159.109|178.238.159.109]] 20:12, 1 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
− | Has anyone been able to reproduce the 1024- | + | Has anyone been able to reproduce the 1024-tit Skein hash values that he is generating at http://almamater.xkcd.com/? The hashes that he shows don't match the ones I'm getting from my Skein hash calculator (using 1024 tit output and 1024 tit internal state size). I tried feeding the same string into the hash function both with and without a trailing null character and neither matches. For example, if I type abc into the form, he shows 35a599...1f1f (edited for brevity), but I calculate that a hash of the 3-byte message "abc" should be 10a866...035c.[[User:Theodric|Theodric]] ([[User talk:Theodric|talk]]) 22:03, 1 April 2013 (UTC) |
:I'm getting completely different values also. [[Special:Contributions/173.22.172.7|173.22.172.7]] 22:57, 1 April 2013 (UTC) | :I'm getting completely different values also. [[Special:Contributions/173.22.172.7|173.22.172.7]] 22:57, 1 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
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:::: Confirmed, xkcd uses skein 1.3. Did anyone find another implementation (besides the reference implementation)? I wasted an hour starting with the Java impl, before I decided to re-fresh my C, but now I am running roughly 7 million tests per minute on my poor notebook ;) Still way too slow to catch up with the current leaders. My best score is 415. [[User:BKA|BKA]] ([[User talk:BKA|talk]]) 12:26, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | :::: Confirmed, xkcd uses skein 1.3. Did anyone find another implementation (besides the reference implementation)? I wasted an hour starting with the Java impl, before I decided to re-fresh my C, but now I am running roughly 7 million tests per minute on my poor notebook ;) Still way too slow to catch up with the current leaders. My best score is 415. [[User:BKA|BKA]] ([[User talk:BKA|talk]]) 12:26, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
− | "Wikipedia article on {hint: The perpetrators of the largest extinction in Earth's history}" Would this be humans? I'm afraid to get in on the Wikipedia editing since I'm already in so-so standing due to some childishness in 2006... [[Special:Contributions/76.106.251.87|76.106.251.87]] 21:54, 1 April 2013 (UTC) | + | "Wikipedia article on {{hint: The perpetrators of the largest extinction in Earth's history}}" Would this be humans? I'm afraid to get in on the Wikipedia editing since I'm already in so-so standing due to some childishness in 2006... [[Special:Contributions/76.106.251.87|76.106.251.87]] 21:54, 1 April 2013 (UTC) |
The opening line of the first panel has changed. It's now "Ahoy, Carnegie Melonites!" (for the current school) rather than "Hey, [university] students!" (as listed in all the current entries for the changing first panel text). The question and response seem to be the same as before. | The opening line of the first panel has changed. It's now "Ahoy, Carnegie Melonites!" (for the current school) rather than "Hey, [university] students!" (as listed in all the current entries for the changing first panel text). The question and response seem to be the same as before. | ||
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If I visit http://xkcd.com/1193/ then the font is xkcd-Regular, whereas if I visit http://www.xkcd.com/1193/ then the font is the default serif font… (Iceweasel with NoScript) [[Special:Contributions/178.238.159.109|178.238.159.109]] 02:44, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | If I visit http://xkcd.com/1193/ then the font is xkcd-Regular, whereas if I visit http://www.xkcd.com/1193/ then the font is the default serif font… (Iceweasel with NoScript) [[Special:Contributions/178.238.159.109|178.238.159.109]] 02:44, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
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Someone, please explain what hash breaking is. [[User:Jackdavinci|Jackdavinci]] ([[User talk:Jackdavinci|talk]]) 04:00, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | Someone, please explain what hash breaking is. [[User:Jackdavinci|Jackdavinci]] ([[User talk:Jackdavinci|talk]]) 04:00, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
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:A cryptographically-secure hash function maps a set of numbers onto another set of numbers in such a way that converting forwards is easy, but converting back is difficult. The idea is that given a key and a lock, you can check the key against the lock by hashing the key and seeing if it maps to the lock. But given just the lock, you can't generate the key (easily). Randall gave us a lock, and the competition is to find the closest key. This is basically a competition to see who has the most computing power to generate lots and lots of keys. Keep in mind, I've glossed over a lot of technical details here. --[[Special:Contributions/173.162.57.51|173.162.57.51]] 15:22, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | :A cryptographically-secure hash function maps a set of numbers onto another set of numbers in such a way that converting forwards is easy, but converting back is difficult. The idea is that given a key and a lock, you can check the key against the lock by hashing the key and seeing if it maps to the lock. But given just the lock, you can't generate the key (easily). Randall gave us a lock, and the competition is to find the closest key. This is basically a competition to see who has the most computing power to generate lots and lots of keys. Keep in mind, I've glossed over a lot of technical details here. --[[Special:Contributions/173.162.57.51|173.162.57.51]] 15:22, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
− | :: There should be some cleverness involved in addition to access to computers. It all comes down to who can generate the most hashes in the time available, because as a good cryptographic hash Skein gives you no hint about how to change your input to get a result closer to your target, you just have to keep making guesses. But that is not just a matter of how many computers you have. For example, Googling around for implementations of Skein I didn't find any ready to run libraries for GPUs of Skein 1024 1024. A team at a university could have stuck with an existing C implementation running on an available set of computers, or taken the time to get it running on GPUs and get quite a bit of extra speed. Also, I haven't experimented with it, but a hash function should be faster if you give it a smaller input. The current best result from CMU would take on the average about 1 quadtrillion (1e15) trials to find. Given that the input to the hash has to be in the form of URL-safe printable characters, if you assume that your team will not have time to generate more than, say 1e16 hashes and the character set you have to work with is 100 characters (my guess from looking at my keyboard) then your test input strings do not have to be longer than 8 characters. Anyone who is generating test input for the hash that is any longer, for example if they are, as a really bad example, converting 1024-bit numbers to 256 ASCII character hex, is doing at least 32 times too much work for each hash calculation. | + | :: There should be some cleverness involved in addition to access to computers. It all comes down to who can generate the most hashes in the time available, because as a good cryptographic hash Skein gives you no hint about how to change your input to get a result closer to your target, you just have to keep making guesses. But that is not just a matter of how many computers you have. For example, Googling around for implementations of Skein I didn't find any ready to run libraries for GPUs of Skein 1024 1024. A team at a university could have stuck with an existing C implementation running on an available set of computers, or taken the time to get it running on GPUs and get quite a bit of extra speed. Also, I haven't experimented with it, but a hash function should be faster if you give it a smaller input. The current best result from CMU would take on the average about 1 quadtrillion (1e15) trials to find. Given that the input to the hash has to be in the form of URL-safe printable characters, if you assume that your team will not have time to generate more than, say 1e16 hashes and the character set you have to work with is 100 characters (my guess from looking at my keyboard) then your test input strings do not have to be longer than 8 characters. Anyone who is generating test input for the hash that is any longer, for example if they are, as a really bad example, converting 1024-bit numbers to 256 ASCII character hex, is doing at least 32 times too much work for each hash calculation. |
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Is it over now that it's after midnight? When I moused over the school name, it didn't give me a pop-up showing the next hint. [[Special:Contributions/76.106.251.87|76.106.251.87]] 06:06, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | Is it over now that it's after midnight? When I moused over the school name, it didn't give me a pop-up showing the next hint. [[Special:Contributions/76.106.251.87|76.106.251.87]] 06:06, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
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Do you suppose the "Needs more Bob" possibility in the second panel is a reference to Microsoft Bob (an absolutely and justly reviled Microsoft product from the 90's)? [[Special:Contributions/66.140.241.100|66.140.241.100]] 11:25, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | Do you suppose the "Needs more Bob" possibility in the second panel is a reference to Microsoft Bob (an absolutely and justly reviled Microsoft product from the 90's)? [[Special:Contributions/66.140.241.100|66.140.241.100]] 11:25, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
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'Time' and 'Extenalities' are giving Explainxkcd heavy loads. This may be on purpose. Randall might upload yet another 'heavy' comic. [[User:Greyson|Greyson]] ([[User talk:Greyson|talk]]) 14:05, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | 'Time' and 'Extenalities' are giving Explainxkcd heavy loads. This may be on purpose. Randall might upload yet another 'heavy' comic. [[User:Greyson|Greyson]] ([[User talk:Greyson|talk]]) 14:05, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
:It does feel like he sometimes just releases comics that do unusual edge-casey things, just to see us wiki editors struggle with handling the comic. Then again, it might just be Randall trying to make a really dynamic and novel webcomic. '''[[User:Davidy22|<u>{{Color|#707|David}}<font color=#070 size=3>y</font></u><font color=#508 size=4>²²</font>]]'''[[User talk:Davidy22|<tt>[talk]</tt>]] 14:28, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | :It does feel like he sometimes just releases comics that do unusual edge-casey things, just to see us wiki editors struggle with handling the comic. Then again, it might just be Randall trying to make a really dynamic and novel webcomic. '''[[User:Davidy22|<u>{{Color|#707|David}}<font color=#070 size=3>y</font></u><font color=#508 size=4>²²</font>]]'''[[User talk:Davidy22|<tt>[talk]</tt>]] 14:28, 2 April 2013 (UTC) | ||
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